Muskie Central

[20:06:08] ebijack (mi): OK, LET'S START TALKING OIL!!!!!!!!!!!!

[20:06:23] Drift'r: ok whats the best?

[20:06:38] mikej (mn): the manufactures!

[20:06:39] ebijack (mi): how about you ,mike, what do you use and why

[20:06:45] ebijack (mi): i agree mike

[20:06:53] Drift'r: i agree

[20:06:56] mikej (mn): Quicksliver

[20:07:32] Lundman: I have to be honest, I never thought much about it before, till I

started reading the message board...

[20:08:02] ebijack (mi): i never did either lund till i got involved in experimental engs

[20:08:11] Lundman: I always just got the oil when I needed it, wherever I was at the

time....I bet that makes you cringe eh.....:-)

[20:08:45] mikej (mn): I've got some bad oil doing that

[20:08:54] ebijack (mi): have you seen any of the testing done at merc, mike?

[20:09:02] mikej (mn): no

[20:09:31] mikej (mn): I'm pretty new to merc

[20:10:02] ebijack (mi): there are so many differences in oil, it would fill a small book

[20:10:15] boomer: i use yamalube in my new boat because thats what the dealer

talked me into for the motor. previous to that i ran twc3 lubrimatic in my 40hp merc

[20:10:39] boomer: had no problems

[20:11:16] mikej (mn): If you catch it on sale Quicksliver + is about the same cost as


[20:11:18] Lundman: I think I'm gonna switch over to Amsoil...

[20:11:20] ebijack (mi): the manufactures spend thousands of hours testing oil so the

lubrication is right and low smoke

[20:12:29] Lundman: I started running it in my van, and the gas mileage went up by

about 5 miles a gallon....

[20:12:34] boomer: from what ive been reading i am going to stick with the

manufactures oil

[20:12:35] ebijack (mi): some of the syntheics are pretty good, but keep an eye on your

plugs, they'll tell you how good/bad it is

[20:13:11] ripper: Do the differences in oil make one better than the next in certain

conditions and if so how should I choose.

[20:13:23] mikej (mn): Yea last year i ran cabelas semi

[20:14:13] mikej (mn): ripper use what makes your motor run best

[20:14:19] ebijack (mi): the manufactures is the best. then you have to see how your

idle is , do the plugs foul, etc to see if another brand has the right properties to burn

clean in your motor if you want to change

[20:14:28] mikej (mn): the least smoke and best plug like

[20:14:35] mikej (mn): life that is

[20:16:42] ebijack (mi): you'd be suprised how a oil can seem ok, then run a long time

at full throttle and zip, your bores are scored because the oil couldn't lube at the higher

temps and higher friction

[20:17:10] Lundman: Ok, ebi, how do you know which one will and which one


[20:18:14] ebijack (mi): like i said, the manufactures is the way to go, they did the

testing, i've tried a few synt. oils and one was terrible and one wasn't to bad but still

fouled the plugs

[20:19:43] Lundman: I've heard from more than one person that Amsoil 2 stroke will not

foul plugs...

[20:19:54] ebijack (mi): i bet mike has seen alot of blown motors on boats and it's

because of maintance and cheap oil

[20:20:13] Lundman: Mike, are you a mechanic....?

[20:20:33] ebijack (mi): could be lund, you'll have to try it, i hate putting in 2 gallons of

oil to find out i don't like it

[20:20:43] mikej (mn): Ive never had a motor blow but I always use the manf

[20:20:43] FishinMagician: How can a TCW III rated oil not perform properly?

[20:21:08] mikej (mn): lund no a fisherman

[20:21:12] Esf-wi: Hey I might be getting a used 1994 Starcraft

[20:21:17] Lundman: :-)

[20:21:43] boomer: thats ok i did have a bad arm a year ago

[20:22:02] ebijack (mi): not all motors need the same oil to run right, every motor has

different properties

[20:22:09] Esf-wi: got to go eat

[20:22:11] *** Esf-wi has left Walleye Central

[20:22:54] ebijack (mi): i wouldn't use omc oil in a merc and visa versa

[20:23:12] FishinMagician: I have been running a discount store's oil in my motor for 6

years, approx 8 gal/yr and no problems.

[20:23:20] ebijack (mi): the blocks/pistons/rings are all different

[20:23:30] Seamaster: Use what the OEM recamends. The have done all the testing

for you.

[20:23:32] mikej (mn): stick with it then fishin

[20:23:52] Drift'r: is it ok to buy the brand names out of a bulk container

[20:24:20] ebijack (mi): good fishin, but at $12,000 for a motor i wouldn't chance it,

[20:24:51] White Cloud: Walley report for lake ERIE ???

[20:24:52] ebijack (mi): i would buy it off the shelf, dealers get a different mix than

what's in the bottle

[20:25:11] Seamaster: I'll sell you my complete boat for 12,000

[20:25:17] FishinMagician: Does any one know if the label TCW 3 does not contain

necessary elements if it is from a discount store?

Whisper sent to [White Cloud]: e-mail ric he'll help you

[20:25:41] ebijack (mi): that's only a basic number for tcw111

[20:25:48] prairiepillow: why is that jack if it has the same name?

[20:26:11] mikej (mn): Cheaper oils may not have the additives that the manuf do

[20:26:40] mikej (mn): you could end up with my carbon

[20:26:50] FishinMagician: What kind of additives?

[20:27:13] Seamaster: It's like the saying goes,,,,, pay me now or pay me later!!

[20:27:29] prairiepillow: so what is on the shelf is the best and the bulk is not as good a


[20:27:32] Lundman: Ok, so which one is the best grade, In the gallon jugs from the


[20:27:53] Drift'r: then you are saying that a 55 Gal drum of OMC oil is different than a 1

Gal packaged OMC oil

[20:28:21] ebijack (mi): yes pp, that's where most of the law suits would come from, "

joe regular" bought it off the shelf so that's the best they make

[20:28:23] mikej (mn): It could be if the dealer bought other oil

[20:28:24] Lundman: I don't understand why they would do that....the dealer I


[20:28:41] ripper: what benefits would make it worth changing from the manufacturers

and how would you start to shop for something different

[20:28:53] FishinMagician: Who makes OMC's oil for them? I don't believe they have

their own refinery.

[20:29:25] prairiepillow: in your opinion then jack what oil is the best ?

[20:29:26] ebijack (mi): they contract 3 manufactures to blend oil

[20:29:28] Seamaster: It is made to OMC standards.

[20:29:49] ebijack (mi): one for factory fill, one for dealers, and the shelf

[20:29:57] mikej (mn): fishin they probably have it refined elseware but have additional

additives put in

[20:30:01] FishinMagician: The Tech 2000 TCW3 oil from Walmart states that it meets

or exceeds the original manufacturers specifications.

[20:30:06] Lundman: but why would OMC provide one grade for the shelf, and one

grade for the dealer's application, that does not make any sense to me

[20:30:24] boomer: me either

[20:30:28] ebijack (mi): $$$$$$$ they save money

[20:30:30] Lundman: Why would they not want the same quality for ever motor they


[20:30:35] Magic Marker: doesn't to me either?

[20:30:53] Lundman: That's bull, One more reason to not trust the dealer if you ask


[20:31:15] Drift'r: you got it lund

[20:31:27] FishinMagician: What would you rather pay, 6.50/gallon or 16.95 per


[20:31:31] prairiepillow: seems like that is just asking for trouble

[20:31:32] Seamaster: I use Pensoil 10w40 in my motor

[20:31:53] FishinMagician: LOL

[20:32:08] Seamaster: It works great

[20:32:24] FishinMagician: What do you have, a four stroke?

[20:32:28] Lundman: I understand them wanting to save money, bulk oil should be

cheaper in price, but not in quality.....far as I'm concerned then they are giving

someone they sell a new boat to an inferior oil....

[20:32:31] Seamaster: dose'nt smoke at all

[20:32:59] Drift'r: you got it lund

[20:33:01] Seamaster: Yep:)

[20:33:04] ebijack (mi): it still meets the specs, but the additives are of a cheaper quality

[20:33:05] Lundman: that's crap

[20:33:17] Magic Marker: I agree with Lund, this is ridiculas

[20:33:41] Lundman: specs shmecks......They are rippin us off....

[20:33:49] Magic Marker: gotta get my boys to teach me to spell :-)

[20:33:54] FishinMagician: It would be nice if we could get the TCW3 oil manufacturers

to engage in this chat one night!!!!

[20:33:56] Drift'r: i could have fallen victim if not for this chat

[20:34:10] Drift'r: me too MM

[20:34:48] Drift'r: we can try to get them FM

[20:35:16] Seamaster: Nothing is better than good PM on your engines. If you do that

and use a good quality oil , you will have a long life on your out board motor!!!

[20:35:31] FishinMagician: That's one night I know I would be here for sure!!!

[20:36:14] FishinMagician: Why?

[20:37:17] ripper: If the names the same legally the product should be too no matter the

size, Right?

[20:37:18] Lundman: I think we both spelled it Wrong SM....:-)

[20:37:33] prairiepillow: you would think so ripper

[20:37:35] FishinMagician: I agree with you, ripper

[20:37:52] Lundman: :-)

[20:37:56] ebijack (mi): legally sure, but who wants to fight

[20:38:14] ebijack (mi): i rather have a better running longer lasting motor

[20:38:44] ripper: I would think anyone who has lost an engine to bad oil that they

thought good oil!

[20:38:47] Lundman: Well, far as I'm concerned, it's just one more way to them to make

maximum profit, minimum expense....

[20:39:06] ebijack (mi): i've run the same plugs for 6 yrs in my merc, when i switched

oils i went thru 3 sets in 2 years

[20:39:30] ebijack (mi): so what's your point lund, that's why they'er there

[20:40:07] FishinMagician: Ebi, is changing plugs once in 6 years preventive


[20:40:21] ripper: So ebi why did you switch to begin with

[20:40:31] ebijack (mi): no, it always started, weren't fouled so no need to change

[20:40:38] Lundman: Point is, what ever happened to being concerned about the

customer, and not money being the primary object, don't get me wrong, I know that's

why they are in buisness

[20:40:41] ebijack (mi): to try synt. oil

[20:40:54] Lundman: but when the money comes first, thats wrong, in my opinion

[20:40:57] Seamaster: Ebi, you should replace you plugs more than that due to worn

plugs loose thier heat range

[20:41:05] bob (oh): customer has never been as important as profit

[20:41:45] bob (oh): you should replace them ebi, cause somebody makes them and

they need a job

[20:41:46] Seamaster: yea ebi

[20:41:55] Lundman: Oil did Mike...?

[20:41:59] FishinMagician: You'll have to get them out with a hammer and a


[20:42:01] ebijack (mi): nope on the siezeing, i check my motor often

[20:42:28] boomer: i change mine once ayear and check and clean twice during


[20:42:41] ebijack (mi): zero gap plugs here

[20:42:45] FishinMagician: Do you guys think it would be possible to get OMC to join in

one night?

[20:42:59] ebijack (mi): we've been trying and we tried merc too

[20:43:25] Griz: has PinPoint ever been here?

[20:43:26] Seamaster: I love my mercruser 4 banger

[20:43:34] Magic Marker: how about a good omc mechanic

[20:44:01] ebijack (mi): drift r is working on pin point

[20:44:07] bob (oh): there's an omc tech that answers guestion on maybe

he'd come on

[20:44:35] Lundman: Ya, seahorse I think he goes by...

[20:44:37] ebijack (mi): i spent 3 yrs running 2 strokes on dyno's, and i was amazed at

the differences in oil

[20:44:50] Griz: I'm a phone call away from buying one. Got any thoughts on them?

[20:44:58] FishinMagician: We need to have several of the oil manufacturers/retailers

on at once.

[20:45:06] Lundman: Ok, ebi , so the best one for Johnson would be the OMC gallons

off the shelf...?

[20:45:47] ebijack (mi): i'd say that is the safest to use

[20:46:02] FishinMagician: Ebijack, is OMC a sponsor of yours?lol

[20:46:26] ebijack (mi): the best oil i ran was a special blend for racing motorcycles, (for

lubing) but it smoked alot

[20:46:38] bob (oh): so how much can you save in a season not using manf. oil?

[20:46:40] ebijack (mi): nope, i've got a 14 yr old 200 merc

[20:47:06] Lundman: depends on how much you use I would think

[20:47:23] FishinMagician: bob, that is a good point, however, I have had no problems

with the other oil.

[20:48:09] bob (oh): no, i just wondered if it was worth the gamble, i don't run OB

[20:48:16] FishinMagician: As a matter of fact almost all of my friends use WalMart oil

[20:48:16] ebijack (mi): hey, if you like it use it, but if your having problems with your

motors idle, fouling plugs etc. it the cheaper oil your using so don't blame the


[20:48:58] FishinMagician: I guarantee you ebi, that if my motor doesn't run properly, I

would change oil in a heartbeat.

[20:49:24] ebijack (mi): what hp you have fishin

[20:49:29] Magic Marker: my motor under warrenty 5 more years, so will stick with

manuf. oil

[20:49:31] FishinMagician: By, the way, what about the welded vs.riveted?

[20:49:50] bob (oh): I don't know anything about them, but had omc tech tell me you

see the difference when you tear them down ????

[20:50:03] ebijack (mi): the bigger motors running the higher rpm are where it is the

most critical!!

[20:50:14] FishinMagician: What kind of warranty on a motor last over 5 years?

[20:51:10] Magic Marker: 2 year plus 5 year extended, 115 johnson, 97 model

[20:51:17] bob (oh): i think someone should weld the rivets on a boat and they would

satisfy everyone :-)

[20:51:18] ebijack (mi): what hp you have fishin

[20:51:31] FishinMagician: What did a 5yr extended cost?

[20:51:35] FishinMagician: 70

[20:51:58] Magic Marker: 750 dollars

[20:52:13] White Cloud: amen bob

[20:52:13] mikej (mn): throw out the rivets and go fiberglass!!!

[20:52:29] ebijack (mi): ok, just so you realize that the big motors spinning the higher

rpm's is where the oil is most important

[20:52:32] bob (oh): fiberglass the rivets????

[20:52:35] Magic Marker: I'll trade boats by then though

[20:52:44] mikej (mn): no throw them

[20:52:49] FishinMagician: ok, ebi, I'll go along with that.

[20:52:52] White Cloud: rivets

[20:53:07] Richard Mellon: Ya, Mike I'm starting to get pumped.

[20:54:08] FishinMagician: I had a 16 foot riveted boat get hit in the back end by a 27

foot sailboat going about 10 mph and my boat never leaked.

[20:54:22] Drift'r: i just wanted to know what i was doing when i decided on a boat ,

welded or riveted

[20:55:11] FishinMagician: I don't know if it really makes any difference. Have you

heard any horror stories about the welded ones?

[20:55:14] Lundman: I don't really think it matters a whole lot, there are good boats

either way...

[20:55:39] Magic Marker: get one with a fish guarentee :-)

[20:55:45] Lundman: ....:-)

[20:55:51] bob (oh): i think buy the one you like and enjoy it

[20:55:57] FishinMagician: I did talk to one guy who had a welded boat (brand new)

out on Lake Ontario and the hull cracked.

[20:56:00] White Cloud: ;-)

[20:56:02] Drift'r: bobs reply sumed it up for me . Put your money down & hope for the


[20:56:06] ebijack (mi): not alot of interest yet reefer for that tourney

[20:56:16] White Cloud: ;P

[20:56:27] FishinMagician: When he took it back to the dealer they told him that they

would have to rivet a patch on the hull.

[20:56:33] bob (oh): i have a friend who has a glass boat that blistered 2 years in a row,

but he bought another glass boat - different brand

[20:56:36] Drift'r: MM also

[20:56:57] Magic Marker: what make- model fish

[20:57:04] FishinMagician: Crestliner

[20:57:20] bob (oh): i think you get good and bad in almost any boat - horror stories

enough to go around

[20:57:36] Drift'r: i agree bob

[20:57:41] Magic Marker: i've run mine awful hard, no problems yet

[20:57:42] FishinMagician: He called the factory and they told him he would have to

bring it out to their factory if he wanted it welded.

[20:57:48] mikej (mn): how true bob

[20:58:20] Magic Marker: what model fish?

[20:58:29] FishinMagician: I have a buddy who bought a Bass Tracker that had loose

rivets in the bow even before it hit the water.

[20:58:34] bob (oh): is yours crestliner MM

[20:58:52] Magic Marker: yes, 1750 sportfish

[20:59:18] bob (oh): The glass boat i'm talking about was a $44,000 27 footer and it

blistered twice

[20:59:26] Lundman: whoa....

[20:59:28] White Cloud: Does Bass Tracker make a boat ????

[20:59:37] FishinMagician: If the manufacturer gives you a good warranty and stands

behind it, who cares whether it's welded or riveted?

[21:00:14] Lundman: They have their name on them, but I think OMC boat group

makes them don't they Ebi....??

[21:00:18] FishinMagician: Bass Pro Shops sell about 65 boats a day.

[21:01:20] ebijack (mi): both welded and rivets are strong, you'd have to get into type

of alum. used and how many psi strength the weld/or rivet has with that alum

[21:01:35] Lundman: Good point Ebi...

[21:01:39] ebijack (mi): the tracker? can't remember

[21:02:02] Richard Mellon: Only tournament boat I ever broke was aluminum, 4 glass

boats no probs. Drirt'r -- Alberta - Mike an I compete on the PWT.

[21:02:06] mikej (mn): there you go again ebi getting tech on us

[21:02:13] Lundman: :-)

[21:02:14] Drift'r: tracker is tracker with no one else

[21:02:30] ebijack (mi): can't help it mike, i was at it for about 20yrs :)

[21:02:45] FishinMagician: A friend of mine drove out to Springfield to pick his up. He

said you wouldn't believe the number of boats that were picked up that day.

[21:02:46] mikej (mn): I believe so Drift

[21:02:53] Lundman: They have their own plant Drift'r...?

[21:03:12] mikej (mn): yea its around spingfield

[21:03:16] Drift'r: yes they do in springfield

[21:03:30] mikej (mn): actually i think they have 3 plants

[21:03:35] Lundman: Speaking of Aluminum, did you guys know that Skeeter is making

an aluminum boats now..?

[21:03:45] FishinMagician: No, I didn't.

[21:03:54] Richard Mellon: Tracker is now the largest manufacturer of boats in the

world 14 lines in all now.

[21:04:08] Lundman: Wow!!

[21:04:13] Drift'r: they have a trailer plant a glass plant & an aluminum plant

[21:04:43] FishinMagician: Those Targas look nice.

[21:04:48] Drift'r: they just bought fisher & pro craft

[21:05:03] Richard Mellon: They own Tracker Nitro Fisher Procraft Astro To name a


[21:05:27] Lundman: Holy Cow.....learn somethin' new every day...:-)

[21:05:43] FishinMagician: Have there ever been any proper testing comparing

strengths of riveted vs. welded?

[21:05:47] bob (oh): you mean their bigger than brunswick which owns about a dozen

lines including sea ray, bayliner, whaler etc

[21:06:16] Richard Mellon: Tracker owns 25% of brunswick

[21:06:30] Magic Marker: used to own a procraft bassboat, nice boat, before i saw the

light, and fished erie :-)

[21:06:40] *** Baker Marine has joined Walleye Central

[21:06:45] ebijack (mi): yes fishin, all the manufactures wouldn't put out a boat that

wasn't tested to meet their requirements

[21:06:49] ebijack (mi): howdy sam!!

[21:06:52] Lundman: Hey Bakers....

[21:06:56] Baker Marine: Hello. Sorry I'm late.

[21:06:58] Drift'r: hi baker

[21:07:10] ebijack (mi): hey folks, sam here has a lot of data on oils , he runs FAST


[21:07:10] Baker Marine: Hey everybody.

[21:07:20] peepsight: hello baker

[21:07:34] FishinMagician: No, what I mean is has there been a comparison test with

same aluminum type and thickness.

[21:07:52] FishinMagician: Hi, Baker

[21:08:01] Baker Marine: What's everybody usin' for oil? I'm interested in whether or

not everybody is sticking with their OEM oil or are you running aftermarket?

[21:08:11] ebijack (mi): you wouldn't make a hull the same design since you could weld

it vs having to rivet it

[21:08:15] Magic Marker: oem

[21:08:21] ebijack (mi): oem

[21:08:22] FishinMagician: Aftermarket

[21:08:30] mikej (mn): oem

[21:08:34] Lundman: Aftermarket...

[21:08:45] Lundman: But I'm switching...:-)

[21:09:04] Baker Marine: How about synthetics? Has anybody tried a synthetic oil yet?

[21:09:08] FishinMagician: What's the difference, BM?

[21:09:09] Richard Mellon: oem if its free after market otherwise

[21:09:30] FishinMagician: No to the synthetics.

[21:09:36] ebijack (mi): yep sam, one pretty good, one NFG

[21:09:37] Baker Marine: OEM is say...Mercury oil, or Yamalube, or Evinrude oil.

Aftermarket would be Pennzoil, Itasca, etc.

[21:09:38] Lundman: not yet, but I think I'm going to try Amsoil

[21:09:44] ^2old2^ (mi): this is the first year i've tried aftermarket

[21:09:57] Richard Mellon: yes to expensive for the dif in perf

[21:09:57] ^2old2^ (mi): in 4 yrs running

[21:10:33] Baker Marine: I'm glad I caught you Lundman. Amsoil is NOT TCW-3 rated

yet. I would stay away from any synthetic that is not TCW-3 rated.

[21:11:14] Lundman: Really, I have talked to more than one person who say they love

it, no smoke, no foul.....??

[21:11:28] Whisper from Drift'r to [ebijack (mi)]: this was a great idea Tom

[21:11:29] Lundman: and no problems....yet...:-)

[21:11:42] ^2old2^ (mi): is snowmobile oil that is tcw-3 rated safe to use in an outboard

[21:11:59] Baker Marine: I agree with you lundman, but Itasca and Klotz are TCW-3

rated - no warranty problems. Mercury marine can tell if a motor was running Amsoil,

because when they break they do the same exact thing everytime.

[21:12:38] Lundman: Alrighty then, I guess I won't , will probly just go get some OMC oil

then, thanks Baker...!!!

[21:12:49] ebijack (mi): sticky rings? Sam

[21:13:20] Baker Marine: What happens, is non-TCW3 synthetics don't coat the

cylinders. Water beads up, creates rust, the rings rub against it and go away quicker.

[21:13:41] Lundman: Whoa....that would be bad....:-)

[21:13:46] Magic Marker: any difference in johnson----evenrude oil ?

[21:13:51] ebijack (mi): water mixes with the synthetics

[21:13:55] Magic Marker: both omc

[21:14:23] Baker Marine: Johnson motors and Evinrude motors will be different for '99 -

so will accessories.

[21:14:29] ebijack (mi): it doesn't seperate like regular oil

[21:14:32] Lundman: Evinrude will be Ficht right...?

[21:14:33] FishinMagician: ebi, what does the mixing of the water and synthetic oil do?

[21:14:48] Baker Marine: Water doesn't mix with synthetics that's why it beads up on

the cylinder. Just like if you drop water into oil it will separate.

[21:15:01] Magic Marker: oil be different then?

[21:15:14] ebijack (mi): it doesn't seperate like regular oils

[21:15:14] Baker Marine: Evinrudes will be four stroke up to and including 70hp. Ficht

from 90 - 225.

[21:15:32] Lundman: I have a question, has anyone ever used anything like slick 50 in

an there such a thing for two strokes..?

[21:15:50] Drift'r: Baker , what is your opinion of bulk OMC oil & a single gal. of OMC


[21:15:56] FishinMagician: Yeah, they have it, but I haven't used it.

[21:15:58] Baker Marine: True, synthetics will disperse water much better than

petroleum based oils, but will still not necessarily mix.

[21:16:20] Baker Marine: Bulk - vs gallon same oil, but cheaper. We sell bulk and

people love it at our marina.

[21:16:29] ebijack (mi): yes sam, but they don't tend to seperate after settling like reg.


[21:16:48] Baker Marine: Slick 50 for outboards doesn't work - don't bother.

[21:16:48] Drift'r: is there any differance in the grade of it

[21:17:09] ebijack (mi): have to disagree with ya on that sam,

[21:17:57] ^2old2^ (mi): is there any difference if it says outboard or snowmobile

TCW-3 on the can

[21:18:09] Baker Marine: We've tried it. With a 2-stroke, it will burn off with the exhaust

before it has a good chance to coat the cylinders. We've had much better luck in

teflon coating the pistons - now that works!

[21:18:10] ebijack (mi): they contract out for 3 manufactures of oil, one for factory fill

one for dealer bulk and one for bottles

[21:18:31] Drift'r: if you were a consumer & bought a new Ficht would you run bulk?

[21:19:03] Baker Marine: It may be a different manufacturer - true, but from what we

here, the formula is SUPPOSED to have the same additives, etc. But I might be wrong


[21:19:32] ebijack (mi): it would take to long to type it all out sam, but they are different

[21:19:34] Baker Marine: I would run any TCW-3 oil. We've had good luck with Citgo

bulk, OMC bulk, Mercury bulk, etc. but just make sure it's TCW-3.

[21:19:44] Lundman: See what I mean....."supposed to".....

[21:19:57] Baker Marine: I'll take your word for it. I think they're the same color?

[21:20:33] ^2old2^ (mi): we run into a problem one year up to drummond where the ran

out of outboard oil all they had was snowmobile oil

[21:20:38] bob (oh): these guys are spending millons of $ on their oil, I;ll bet it's made

the way they want it

[21:20:50] ebijack (mi): if you compared them they might be slightly different, depends

on what additives they are going cheaper on

[21:20:51] FishinMagician: What about the Tech 2000 TCW# from Walmart?

[21:21:02] FishinMagician: TCW3

[21:21:12] Baker Marine: I'll tell you what I do. I have a Mercury 340 HP drag motor

that will turn about 10,200 rpms in a quarter mile. I run Klotz Synthetic and have not

had a single problem. Regular oil would break down under those circumstances and I

would have more problem

[21:21:21] bob (oh): eib, why would they take a chance on going cheaper on an oil to

put in their warrented engines???

[21:21:57] FishinMagician: Meets or exceeds manufacturers specifications!!!

[21:22:01] Baker Marine: It's funny, but ebi hit it on the head. OMC does not make oil -

they make motors. They get their oil from somebody else and put their name on it and

charge a profit.

[21:22:06] Magic Marker: yeah, why?

[21:22:21] FishinMagician: Profit, what else?

[21:22:30] ebijack (mi): you have double oil for breakin, (use chaper oil) then most buy

bottle oil and not dealer bulk (again a bit cheaper oil)

[21:22:55] Baker Marine: While not all oils are created equal, if it's TCW-3 rated, it will

satisfy your warranty, but there are so many advantages to a good oil.

[21:23:00] bob (oh): sure, they don't make oil, but they're staking their motors and

reputation on it and you think they're going to take a chance !!!!

[21:23:09] Lundman: Where can a guy get the Klotz?

[21:23:27] Baker Marine: Synthetics don't smoke nearly as much and what little smoke

you do get actually smells good! No carbon to foul up your spark plugs either.

[21:23:33] FishinMagician: How long has this Klotz oil been tested?

[21:24:00] FishinMagician: Have any of you run this oil for an extended time?

[21:24:17] Lundman: Tell you what, if it's good enough for 10 thousand RPM's, it's

good enough for me.....:-)

[21:24:25] Baker Marine: Good question Lundman. You can get it from us. Check our

website and give us a call or e-mail us. Klotz is a huge two cycle

lube manufacturer for 36 years now.

[21:24:40] Magic Marker: how long does your motor run before rebuild?

[21:24:59] Baker Marine: I have a lot of our customers running it in Bass boats, and ski

boats - mostly because of the lack of smoke.

[21:25:21] bob (oh): thought FICHT was suppose to be almost smoke free

[21:25:28] Lundman: Will it work as good in lower horsepower engines as well


[21:25:36] ebijack (mi): only because it uses less fuel

[21:25:42] Baker Marine: I replace pistons - at 10,000 rpms, the locating rings fall out -

but I have not replaced a single ring yet - other than when I replace that piston for the

locating pin issue.

[21:25:56] ebijack (mi): it's not a critical in lower rpm engs

[21:26:07] mikej (mn): gotta go all

[21:26:19] bob (oh): nite mike

[21:26:19] Reefer: that's right ebi, more fuel efficient but same mixture.

[21:26:24] FishinMagician: See ya later guys. It's been fun. I'm going to check out

Baker's site.cya mike

[21:26:24] ebijack (mi): yeah, that is the toughest part sam, we borke tons over that pin

[21:26:35] Reefer: see ya mike stay in touch.

[21:26:44] Baker Marine: Ficht is almost Emission free, but it only reduces oil by about

50% or so - still a bunch.

[21:26:44] Lundman: Ya, but I figure with the problems I've already had, I would like for

that not to happen again....

[21:26:47] bob (oh): nit fishin

[21:28:58] Baker Marine: We actually sell it at a pretty deep discount. We're a

distributor, so we pass that on to you. We have retail and our sale price on the website.


[21:30:09] Baker Marine: I'm going to get going. Sorry for being late again. Try to catch

you all next time. If you have any individual questions, e-mail me at or go to our website at

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