Speed?

[jlong]

How do you guys factor in SPEED to your presentations? Do you use it to be more efficient? Do you feel it may trigger a reaction? Is it better at certain times of the year? The "old school" suggests that you increase speed with increasing water temperature... but what about during decreasing temps? I've seen speed work in 39 degree water temps. Was that a fluke?

And just how fast is FAST? Mr. Wiley and company know that a lure cruisin' along at 8 MPH is nothing for a fish to capture.

jlong

[MattGawlik@ERC]

Tank,

When determining speeds I consider water temp, time of year, and the general attitude of the fish (if possible). I am sure that one could also consider clarity and time of day, I do not (unless we are talking night hunting). If a pattern doesnt present itself I will throw change-ups.
I learned that speed is much more of a patterning factor than color, fishing bass tourneys. I havnt proven my speed theories in the muskie world but they will form in time.



Matt Gawlik
E.R.C.

"I got more flavor than Fruit Stripe gum"
bb

[MikeRichardson@ERC]

Me too. Red Bull works best.

[john skarie]

I let the fish tell me what they want. If speed isn't working, then I go slow. Sounds simple, but there are times when a very slow surface lure or suick worked so slow it's barely under the water will have follow after follow as well as hits, when speed has come up empty.

Personally on follows I like to go back with something very slow.

JS

[Trophymuskie]

Jason,
speed is an important factor in any presentation but aspecialy when your talking trolling. Now the way I see it I try to fish as fast as I can get away with to cover more water. Depending on the conditions yes speed can be a trigger and the way I see it thats most of the time. Today the water temps were 51-53 and I caught fish ( all big ones ) at 4 MPH trolling willeys and believers and 5.5 MPH ( GPS speed going up current ) with a spinnerbait in the propwash then I lost it after a minute fight but it was a big one.

Speed can work all the time but naturaly it is more effective during the warm water months but not always. I have caught fish as fast as 10 MPH and as slow as 2 MPH depending on the lures and conditions of the day is what makes me decide what speed I think would work best for the day.

Now some lures are great at any speeds but others work only in a certain speed ranges so that can change the speed I will use at the time. No need to troll lures at speeds that makes them run on top or in circles. So I have lures for slow trolling, medium and fast trolling.

Remember that you cannot troll fast enough so that a muskie cannot get it. I use the same in my casting presentation but I can't retreive at 10 MPH LOL. Naturaly my side to side jerks are slow baits and my spinnerbaits are good for burning.

39 days left in the season to catch that 55+. :)

Catch a big one this fall
Keep releasing them all
Richard Collin
http://www.trophymuskiecharters.com

[kmon]

Boy I was going to talk about some of the stuff I learned this year (my first year musky fishing) and Richard chimes in and it's all covered already.
Great question and responses. Thanks from me to all the pros.

[divani]

I have noticed that northerns tend to appreciate a faster running bait when trolling when it's absolutely freezing! That explains why speedtrolling with deep running trollingbaits, but only 3-4m behind the boat, is so effective over here. Some guy even took two of 117cm and one of 109cm on one day while trolling in a 2m deep canal in wintertime and it was about minus 6°C!! Also, I found that when casting in wintertime, slow down your retrieve and cast every spot at 20cm intervals. This is me fishing in canals. I don't know if you're able to fish in wintertime? Trying to find out is better than saying: hey, now it's this cold: fish superslow or just fish extremely fast. It doesn't work that way!

[Don Pfeiffer]

Hi , good question and when fishing I will vary my speed from cast to cast till I have some action on one then use that most often. The other day was fishing and my partner got a hit. I was ripping my zig zg bait back to the boat so I could get the net and one hit that so who really knows. trial and error I guess is the answer.
Don Pfeiffer

[strike_zone]

A muskie or northern is capable of a short-run burst of speed of close to 30 mph. So, if a fish really wants your bait, you can't retrieve it or troll it fast enough to take it away from them. That being said, normally larger fish will not chase baits at those speeds, but if you whip it past their face, even when they're in a neutral or negative mood, they may take a crack at it. This requires an exceptional degree of confidence and knowledge of the structure you are fishing. It also means you have a tiny margin of error in terms of how you have set up your equipment - in particular, you're drag!

I typically run baits from 3 mph to 9 1/2 mph. The fastest speed I have run at and successfully landed a fish was just over 8 1/2 mph. I have landed several at this upper end, the biggest a 44 1/2" pig that clobbered a 10" Jake. I have had a hit on a Sledge at 9 1/2 mph, but did not get hooks into that fish.

To run baits at these speeds, rod holders are mandatory. Without them, you'll NEVER get a hookset. A looser drag is also a must, or things will start busting - straightened hooks, ripped open split rings, broken hangers, broken line, or worse yet, broken rods. Graphite rods should NOT be used at these speeds, as the stress put on them when a fish hits is phenomenal. They are not designed to handle such stress levels and sooner or later you will have a real bad experience if you perist in using a graphite rod.

Your biggest difficulty will be finding baits that will reliably run at these speeds. There are very few that will run this fast, perhaps 1 in 15 baits. Even then, a bait that is out of tune will not run at these speeds, as will a leaker. I have used 10" Jakes, 9" Sledges (weighted with rattles), Magnum Rapala Shad Raps, and big spinnerbaits at these speeds successfully.

Normally, the heat of summer is the most productive. But, there are times in the fall, even during the cold water period where the thermometer dips below 40F that speed will produce. The question is often just how fast is enough. There is no black and white answer. It depends on what the fish want. I've seen the fish crush Sledges at 6 1/2 mph in mid-November in 38F water, and nothing else would get touched.

My rule of thumb is to start off with a modest speed for the time of year you are fishing. If the fish simply won't hit, keep increasing the speed until you reach extremes. If they still won't hit, go the other way with the speed (down) or try another presentation tactic or location.

But, be ever mindful that the colder the water gets, the less likely a big fish is to hit a fast moving bait unless you just about bean them off the snout with it. I've caught an awful lot of muskies at speeds of 6 mph of faster, and some big fish too. But I have generally found that the key is to give the fish only as much speed as necessary to elicit a strike. The faster you move beyond that point, the lesser the chances that a big fish will munch your bait.

Hope this helps,

Steve Wickens

[jlong]

I'm not a troller, but I do try to incorporate what the seasoned trollers utilize to be successful at my casting. One advantage I feel that casting has is that ability to incorporate both FAST and SLOW triggers in the same cast. Sure, you can turn the boat and have the outside speed up and the inside line slow down... but those are long, drawn out speed variations. I'm more referring to the classic Rip and Rest tactic otherwise known as the pull/pause casting method. I use the term RIP because it better describes the speed and acceleration you are giving the bait.

I don't back off on how hard I rip the bait when cold water prevails... but I do exaggerate the pause a little. The only challenge for me in the cold water is maintaining depth. The troller can work the 20 foot range real easy whereas the caster is less efficient in that range. Sinking baits are usually needed.

What are the HOT sinking baits these days for the caster? Fuzzy Duzzits? Countdown Depthraiders? Others? And are you ripping them or just workin' them slow to keep them down?

jlong