4 wheeler/snowmobile

[jwilson]

Wondering what people thought would work best for ice fishing. A four wheel drive four wheeler or a snowmobile. I will be looking to pull a small sled behind, any input would be great.

[LUCKYHOOK]

It all depends on how much snow is on ice.
if less than 8" of snow a 4 wheeler is great and can use year round,If more than you will need a sled to do it.

Good Fishing
Wishing for ice
JIM

[Kaz]

J Wilson: I vote for the four wheeler most of the time. Even when you have more snow you will probably stick to places where someone else has driven when the ice is thin. My Mule, a four wheeler with a box and steering wheel, will go through a lot of snow and if it's too deep I drop the plow and make a new road. Most four wheelers used around our area have a plow to clean driveways, or push snow anyhow. Pulling a sled or trailer is a lot easier with a four wheeler than with a Snowmobile. Not to say anything about backing up, that can't be done, even with a reverse. I know my Panther has a reverse and when pulling it's useless. And if you are thinking of getting one or the other, a four wheeler can be used year round. Snow cats don't work to well in the summer. I vote for FOUR WHEELS....Kaz

[Bear]

Joe,

Go with a four wheeler. You can be a little more mobile most times of the year when we don't have snow around here. There are times that the snow is to deep but not very often..

Bear

[Jbob]

Go with a four wheeler. like in the other post they can be used all year long. There are a lot of trails to ride them on during the soft water time. Put a plow and a winch set up and your'e ready to go.

[vetspet(ind)]

i was asking the same questions a month ago as i have to make the same decission...except i will probably wait til next yr since i just spent a wad on a new otterskin magII....another recommendation i heard several times was that the atv's tend to be more reliable...not as prone to break down...don't know if that is a fact...just a number of guys said it..steve

[River_eye]

Although I'm a snowmobile guy myself, it is true that 4-wheelers are more rugged and made to take abuse and keep on going. Snowmobiles are meant for speed and comfort, and will break if you don't take care of them. You will save on gas with the the 4-wheeler, and you won't have to deal with the oil smoke.

[Lundman]

There is a lot to be said, as you can see, for the argument that a wheeler is the best thing to use for ice fishing. I would have to respectfully disagree, however, if, indeed what you are looking for is a machine this would work the best for ice fishing. With a snomobile, there is no place on any lake that you cannot go. This is not always true with a wheeler. When fishin on smaller lakes, they do not get as windswept as larger ones do, and that makes for softer, deeper snow to run across, much too deep for a wheeler. Even on the larger, windswept lakes, you will run across drifts with a hard crust on top, and softer snow underneath. Last year, while up on lake of the woods, we came across a couple of wheelers that were having a hard time of it. We had absolutely no problem making our own way, and not having to rely on already established trails, and or roads, to get where we wanted to go, which happens to be about 8 miles out where no wheelers, trucks, or track van were at, yet. If you want the ultimate in mobility for ice fishing, get a sled, even if it's an older, smaller machine. Then, you will have virtually no restrictions. If you want a machine you can use for more than just ice fishing, then by all means, buy a wheeler. They are great. Personally, I have both, an older, two wheel drive wheeler with a set of chains I can put on it. Minimal investment. This I use until there is enough snow to run a sled on. From then on, it's the snomobile, for the ability to go virtually wherever I want to go.

Good Luck,
Set the Hook!!

Lundman

[THUMPER]

Good Post Lundman.........My thoughts exactly.......

[Tom B]

I gotta chime in for the snowmobile. Last year, we saw lots of wheelers having a horrible time of it when the snow started to get soft. If the rational for getting a wheeler is that you are staying on/close to roads, etc, than just get a 4-wheel pick up or Jeep. If you want to get to where others are not, a snowmobile is the only way to go.

Tom B

[T-Mac]

Depends on your climate.
Here in Montana, most years a snowmobile would be pretty useless due to no snow on the ice. You'd be burning things up on the machine due to lack of snow for lubrication and cooling. Also, we deal with slick, wind polished ice and a sled has no traction nor control. An ATV (with chains some times needed) works best here.
However, in Northen Minnesota, where I used to live, a snowmobile was the ONLY way to go.( if you could not drive there on a plowed road, at least). An ATV would have been stuck in the 4' deep drifts!

[PJM]

River_eye


Here we go again about the smoke and oil. Do you even own a four wheeler or a snowmobile. If you own a snowmobile is it a new four stroke machine. I want to here your opinion in four stroke snowmobiles and why two stroke are no good.......

[PJM]

T Mac

You are right about northern Minnesota with the snow but I worked at the Minnesota State fair one year and there was a company that made a track attachment for four wheelers. I saw it on a Polaris and they added a set of tracks and some extra wheels and it almost looked like a six wheeler but I am not sure how it worked. But now you are adding more money and now you have to start looking at buying a used snowmobile. I own a snowmobile and I can tell you one thing if you don't have alot of snow the machine will run hot. Even on Millac, it seem like even after it snows alot, it seem like the wind blows it off and the snow surface is very hard. I think you have to look at which one will get more all around use and that is a four wheeler. Right now ther is hardly any snow here in Minnesota, so ice fishing will be better with a four wheeler.

[River_eye]

I said I was a snowmobile guy myself, it says that in my post. Yes I own a snowmobile, but not a 4-wheeler. My snowmobile is good for going fast, taking the bumps, going through deep snow, handling tight corners and generally having a good time. I havn't tried a 4-stroke snowmobile. Although I think we'll see more and more of them as time goes by. I can also trust that it won't smoke like my 2-stroke.

We use a Honda foreman 400 4-wheeler at our lodge for hauling everything. It's a tough SOB, and never skips a beat even after all the abuse we put it through. If I did more ice fishing and less snowmobiling, I'd probably trade the sled in for a 4-wheeler, but I don't, so I'm not. I know my sled wouldn't put up with the same abuse.

I'm not comparing the two solely based on their engine design, they're two totally different machines. The oil smoke from a snowmobile is just one factor, and by no means the most important. This is a different discussion and I'm offering info of a different context, but I see you're still stuck on the outboard discussion we had.

[River_eye]

I've seen a six wheel Polaris as well, looked pretty funky, no tracks though. You're right about the 4-wheeler, although you forgot to mention no oil smoke. ;-) just bugging you.

[River_eye]

About the 4-stroke snowmobiles. A friend of mine's uncle is an Arctic cat dealer, so she was able to drive the 4-stroke cat a couple weeks ago that was touring the dealerships. She's not a real tech person, but she commented on the fact that it was really quiet, and although it lacked zip, she said the top speed was good.

I think it will take a while and some redeveloping for these sleds to catch on. The main thing that draws people to snowmobiles is the arm stretching acceleration, so it will be hard to give that up. Also, with a sled, even a small amount of weight can affect the handling significantly. But, if 2-strokes are outlawed in some nature preserves such as Yellowstone, I can see people being more accepting of the 4-stroke's simply because they have no choice.

Part of the reason that I'm a supporter of 4-stroke technology is because of the environmental issues. I learn a lot of disturbing facts about how we affect our environment in my ecology and environmental science courses, and once you know the facts, they're pretty hard to ignore. It's also a reason why I believe that 2-strokes, although incredibly functional, will have to be outlawed. I don't know your age or education level, but unless you are fairly young, you were probably brought up believing that we can dump anything we want on land, in water or into the atmosphere without hurting our environment or future generations.

But, I guess it's asking a lot for you to care about these sort of things, cause you probably have your own problems like anybody else, and you probably won't be living when younger generations have to face the consequences of our actions.

I would appreciate a response from you regarding your views on the issue, especially if they're different from mine. I'm not a fan of arguments, but I do know there's a lot to learn just by listening to other people.

[moreyes]

I have been a snowmnobiler all my life, I ahve both, a 4 wheeler works fine in marginal snow if crusty ar powder up to 12", if you are looking just ice fishing look for a smaller 340 440 500 fan cooled longtrack utility sled they come with reverse,very handy for unloading,liquids generally depend on some snow coming off the track for colling, they all have slide rail susp. generally you should not have problem with them overheating at lower speeds you can also get marginal snow wheel kits for the rails. You could also add some studs for a little more traction. The new sleds are very reliable, any make, other than the usual maintanence.

good luck moreyes

[Gumby]

I notice the argument is restricted to 4 wheeler or snowmobile. I am a fan of both, and realize each has its attributes and limitations. Nobody has suggested buying both, one for deeper snow and the other for just ice and use when there's no snow. I highly recommend thinking of a 6 wheeler (Argos I beleive they're called). My uncle has 4 of them on his ranch in New Mexico, and offer the same if not more versatility than the others. Not only can they be used year round, but can be equiped with tracks for running in snow, but are also usually capable of transporting more than one person, usually discouraged by the other two. Also, they float. I really wouldn't want to be on one of the others should the unthinkable happen. Granted, top speed isn't anywhere near the warp 5 of a sled, but they are kind of fun. Much like a 4 wheeler, they can be outfitted with a blade to move snow, dirt or whathaveyou, and can carry quite a bit of stuff. To me, their biggest downfall is cost, often substantially more than the other choices. Don't get me wrong, I have a sled myself, and use my father-in-law's 4 wheeler whenever the chance comes up, but personally I would like to have one of these machines myself. Now, if those darn Quick Picks would just pay off.........

[LUCKYHOOK]

I have a max 6 wheeler and they are nice but again they can not go through through the real deep stuff or heavu slush. The argo may be better.
It requires a lot of maintenance to keep it running good.
Plusses are it floats if your not sure of the ice conditions. 2 people can go in it. It is pretty slow with the tracks on it and they throw up a lot of snow so you would also want some kind of enclosure around it.
I thought it would be the best of both worlds but i wish i spent my money on a utility sled instead. I have a Polaris 500 and in most cases I can travel the lakes. Only when there is real deep snow do I have to wait for snowmobile trails.

Good Luck on your choice and wish we would get some ice.

JIM

[Tom P]

River-eye , All that you learned in those envro classes might not be all true. (Smoke and mirrors;) PJM will like that one! Most of your professors were most likely "too green" to give an unbias accounting of pollution facts. Your "Mother";) has a way of cleaning itself or herself up. Not oil spills, I know. But a little 2 stroke smoke is not going to take down a eco system. Not even close. I hope you are pushing your employer to use synthetic oil in all that polluting machinery you must drive. I hope you don't dig up any dirt with that snowmobile in spring time, you may affect that Canadian spotted earth worm. The world will be ever affected if they become endangered. I heard you said earlier that synthetic oil is not bio- degradable if it is on the water surface. I ? that one. It is good to watch that you affect "our Mother" the least as possible. We also need a little nudging to get it done in a timley fashion. But we also have to watch out that the "green extremest" don't STEAL our rights to use our "Mother" too. They are thousands of them working daily to do just that. While there are only hundreds (if even) trying to stop them. I'm doing my part to always question "greenism". Because it is almost, almost, is a religion to some. Like radical islam. In some cases being taught by radical greenism professers in our collages

[Dave]

Does anyone know the price of a argo 6 wheeler?
Outfitted with tracks and enclosure, how much are we talking?

Thanks.
Dave.

[Average Guy]

There are "terrorists" that would steal our rights to hunt and fish and use the outdoors using environmental concerns but.....there are also those that even when the proof is staring at them in the face will not see the harm being done. I will call them "counterterrorists". Two stroke motors are a curse to the environment. You are right one is not doing a thing.......but 1,000,000 will.

[River_eye]

Well, as of yet I havn't taken any radical enviro classes, I don't even know if there are any taught at the university. I have taken an introductory ecology class, and although the instructor could have easily used bias while teaching, she did not. I was actually surprised by this, although she made it apparent that because of her knowledge on the subject, she was a bit worried about our current situation. In case you didn't know, ecology is a science, and the world around you is built on science, so you can't question that.

I don't pretend to know everything about our natural world, and neither do any ecology professors, because the truth is, there is still a lot, and I mean a lot, that we don't know. Now, if all of these people who have dedicated their lives to studying the subject are uncertain about our environment, what makes you so sure that we will be allright? Don't worry, I don't expect you to come up with an answer to that one, but give it a moment of thought, okay?

Now, answer me this. If we don't know the true consequences of our actions, wouldn't it be wise to proceed with caution? All wise men would say so, but maybe not you.

You are right on one thing though, mother earth is very resiliant, and she will support life well into the future no matter what, with or without humans, but this is not what I, nor ecologists are worried about. I'm worried simply for humans sake.

Tom P, I respect your stubborness, and the fact that you could definately teach me a few things on subjects that you know more about than me, especially boat transoms. So maybe you could give me the same respect and trust that I maybe able teach you somthing about ecology. Knowledge is a wonderful thing, and I only wish to share it with people.

[rock2me]

I'm sorry to steal this post but I feel the need to respond.

As I recall these same environmentalists and scientists were warning us of the next ice age just a decade or more ago. I vividly remember learning this in school. Which is it?

Weren't they also telling us that the Valdez spill was going to ruin everything forever. As it turned out they found that the environment responded quickly and human efforts hindered some creatures recovery.

Which is better for you butter or margarine. First, it was margarine but now they have found that butter in moderation is better for you. Frying hamgurgers causes carcinogens that will cause cancer. Saccarin (sp) will kill you - after taking off the market - it is now back. Aspartame is safe - now there are many reports that it causes a myriad of problems for some. Breast implants will kill you - fine Dow Chemical to get millions of dollars, then the truth comes out that there was no proven correlation. Oxygenating our fuel will be good for the environment - now MTBE threatens groundwater out west. Oxygenating fuel is good for the envirnoment - now there is information that it actually takes more energy to make then the return and the list goes on.

I suggest getting your information from many different sources and a grain of salt before making conclusions.

It is amazing that any of us even make it to our teens with all the things that kill us.

I definitely do not condone wasting or ruining our resources willy nilly. However, radical changes should be implemented cautiously as the fix may actually cause more harm.

Remember - "Life is Dangerous"


Good Luck!

[Tom P]

Let's proceed with caution, I agree. I use synthetic not only for better protection of my motor, but I know it is better for our environment. I recycle, I sold my Lawn Boy and didn't buy a new one even though I'm a Lawn Boy guy. Why did John Stasil call SOME of this so call science "junk science" and he had experts not backing global warming or some of the stuff you say is science fact. Who wrote and approved your science book?? They leave things out of our new politically correct history books from what I've been told. The person who is being taught from that book would be clueless of a fact if it was not in that book or brought up by the teacher. I'm kind'a on your side but don't want the ( analogy: islamic radical end) of the enviromental groups to dictate what is true or false about it. I feel through things I have seen and read they have a major foot hold on that subject and are lying to us because of their bent ideology that is almost a religion. That gets picked up by some students as fact and years later there is this envro cult and all of a sudden the sky is falling. Some of these groups are as bent as radical islam . I'm just asking "wait a minute, the sky is not falling" I'm willing to take the heat for my veiws because I don't believe it is that bad. Someone has to stick up for the other side every so often. I 'am not sticking up for big business, some of them would dump nuclear waste in our back yard if they knew they could get away with it. Like I said earlier the center is where it is at so we all can keep using our toys in the woods and lakes. We are closer then you think. I just don't bring up breathing smoke and oil on posts like you , I bring up transom bracing :)

[Me]

You're living in denial. I'm in my sixties, live in Northern MN, and have hunted, fished, etc. all my life. I am not an environmental extremist, just one who cares what's happening to our world. In my lifetime I have watched as the lakes, forests, etc. have been damaged and reduced. The only difference is that now it has accelerated. The loses come quicker. Look at Red Lake and tell me how "Mother Nature" takes care of it self when we act irresponsibly. And we are acting irresponsibly. We are damaging the environment.

[River_eye]

Well, not that I want this topic to drone on for any length of time, but I'll add another comment. I don't think I can prove to you that anything such as global warming is going on right now, and you can't prove to me it's not, so I think all we can do is be aware of the possibilities.

My personal argument here is simple. One thing that has been proven through many studies of various ecosystems, is that the diversity (number of different species) increases robustness (resistance to disturbance such as disease, removal of one species, etc.). Right now, we have an incredibly beautiful and diverse and robust ecosystem that we are a part of. It is so diverse that like I said earlier, we find it incredibly hard to understand the true complexities of this system. Unfortunately, many common folk, can not comprehend the amount of knowledge out there that is still out there to learn.

Now, it is an undisputed fact that our lifestyle, of many different factors, is the sole cause for species extinction at an alarming rate. So, it is a fact that we are decreasing the diversity and therefore, the robustness of our ecosystems. My mind tells me that somthing is wrong here. We are not guaranteeing that somthing bad will happen, but what we are doing is slowly taking away the guarantee that nothing bad will happen, make sense?

I am not preaching that the sky is falling right now, we are probably fine right now. What I am preaching is that if we choose to ignore common sense, for the purposes of maintaining our extravagent lifestyle, we are making is possible for the sky to fall in the future. There is also good news that with our present knowledge we can make life sustainable well into the future. It's whether we choose to recognize this knowledge.

I still expect you to reject these views, no matter how much sense they make to you, because they probably go against everything you were taught was important in life, besides family and friends. If you were to believe it, it would mean a totally different outlook on life, and I don't think many of us are mentally prepared for that right now. But in the future, we may see some interesting things.

[PJM]

River_eye


All of post from 19 to 26 were well written and some good points were made. Now should the guy buy a 4 Wheeler or a snowmobile?

[River_eye]

From my limited knoledge of the guy and his applications, I would reccomend the 4-wheeler. I wrote that in the first post I made to the topic.