Give it to 'em OR set the hook!?!

[Tom (N.W.Ont)]

Back in the day where all I knew about walleyes was to drag a carolina rigged spinner/minnow combo, we used to always give the fish more line at first detection. We'd either put the rod tip down and as far back as posible before setting the hook, or turn the bail over and let 'em take as much line as it wants.

Now, things for me are now entirely different. I do a lot of jigging now that may or may not have changed how I look at that first-strike scenario. For the most part, that first *tick* on the line is all the chance I give a walleye...he gets the hook set right away. I know that a lot of variables are at play here like aggressiveness, your current catch to hit ratio etc.etc., but all things being equal, I've had great success setting the hook upon first detection.

A good example was this fall (October) when I was fishing a dropoff, and all the walleyes were doing was mouthing the bait like they way smallmouths sometimes do. Upon feeling that strange weightless feeling on the line, we'd set the hook and more often than not, convert.

What is the current trend here? Are guys still giving line or has the institution of slot limits and catch & release changed the way we do business on the lake?

later folks

tom

[SLIPKNOT]

I never give walleyes line, I too usually set the hook upon first detection. The longest I will ever give them is a couple of seconds, and I usually do that about this time of year on rivers when they arent' biting real well.

[s.f.]

great question/observation!

a classic example of why giving them line ISN'T as important as most feel, is the fact that a very high (sometimes higher) percentage of fish that hit a rod in the holder get hooked. the holder doesn't feed out line at first bite detection nor does it set the hook. (another intersting and debateable subject in itself)
when we feel a fish "biting", using a rig or spinner type presentation, the "bite", in fact, that we feel is the reaction of the fish AFTER he makes the initial strike. envision this...the fish sucks the bait in with one single gulp. ALL OF IT AT ONCE EVERYTIME,unless the presentation doesn't allow it. the fish then shakes his head to insure any sand, weeds or uneditable junk flows out through it's gills, avoiding getting caught on the gill rakers. so the tugging feel is not the bite, but the head shake later. ie. ratta tat tat bite is small fish/small head. thump, thump thump is a bigger fish/bigger head. so....feeding line, as far as hooking percentage, IF the presentation allows, doesn't insure better hooking odds or getting the bait securely in the fishes mouth. that all said...when the MONEY is on the line...i feed 'em line anyway.lol #49
hook setting? very over rated as well...in my opinion.

[Tom (N.W.Ont)]

Well, I don't know if hooksets are overrated, but different situations definately lend themselves to different approaches to sinking hooks into flesh.

While trolling spinner-rigs, barely setting the hook is usually sufficient...a sweepset is good. If you're slow trolling (as in the fall) with jigs, I also use a sweepset but with a little more oomph. Still fishing, IMHO, requires a bit more force. I'd hate to have lost some of the big 10 pound+ fish we've caught this year due to a lame hookset.

Of course, all of this is moot depending on what your rod/reel/line combo is... ;-)

tom

[Suzuki]

As an example of a situation where feeding line works for me is when I am fishing rigs with only a small hook and a nightcrawler. The amount of line I feed is determined by how the fish are reacting that day.

[s.f.]

again, good observation and good to try and envision what is taking place on a given day/situation.
in my opinion, the smaller the hook, even more so, eliminates the need to feed line. i actually weigh hooks so as to not only have the smallest in shape but in weight also as some hooks are identical in shape but not in weight. that said...the smaller the hook, especially by weight but very importantly by shape, allows the fish to inhale and swallow with more success, quicker. it's the heavier hooks/jigs etc. that they have trouble eating.
good to trigger the thought process!

#49

[tbomn]

I agree with everything you have said, and just add a little twist to the mix. When using circle hooks.....the idea is NOT to set the hook. This isn't really unique to circle hooks, if practiced with regular type beak hooks on rigs, and spinners, it usually works the same way. Setting the hook isn't what catches fish, the solid pressure in the opposite direction the fish is going, is. Like Steve said, if you have waited until the thump,thump,thump...then the fish has the bait. Figure the fish isn't going to spit out a meal that it has captured, the fish usually will turn, and retreat so the line has a solid drag on it, keeping the line taunt, and just set with a short snap or solid jerk is all that need be done. You see some guys almost leave the boat when they set the hook, I don't feel this is necessary. Actually, the set has been done when the fish has the bait in it's mouth, all you have to do is keep the line tight enough so the hook burys in the the flesh of the mouth, the fish will struggle enough to do this.

These are the opinions of the poster and not necessarily that of the board........;)

Good Fishin'
TBO/MN

[Peanut]

I have always understood that a quick, hard hook set was preferable when jigging with plastic because walleye will spit the artificial bait faster than live bait. With live bait, you can let 'em keep it in their mouths a litle bit and then just a short set to ensure he's on.

I took a rookie fishing this summer - all he knew of fishing was the bass fishin' shows on tv. At first, he just about pulled the spinner rig out of the water he set it so hard. After a couple of laughs, we toned him down a little, and he ended up having a pretty good day.

derrek.

CANADIAN WALLEYE OPEN UP AND SAY "EH"!

[s.f.]

interesting to me how hook setting becomes so important as we know it. fact is, the hook that is in a fishes mouth has only got to travel an inch in any direction, at the most, to reach hookable flesh. i envision the hooksets as we know them, as actually ripping a bigger hole in that flesh than need be, therefore creating more potential of failure. so, as you say, and i agree, the pressure of the bite, the head shake, and the turn of direction by the fish, all adds up to a good hookset. BUT, DON'T blame me when the big one gets away! lol lol

#49

[Cangl]

My thought proccesses and the line angle and slack determine how hard I set the hook with bait. But with crawlers I do perfer to let them run, especially the smaller fish. There usaully are more of the smaller fish together and their first run is often made to "keep" the bait to themselves, not really killing, or swallowing the bait. Just running out from the others until they stop and gulp. A big hook set with a fish with teeth?

[DarrenB]

Perhaps lake walleyes behave differently, but if ever I've seen a textbook example of "Let 'em run" was this weekend fishing at a small reservoir for walleyes. The story here is I was fishing around submerged rock ledges, rocky piles and dropoffs etc a few feet out from shore in a currentswept river. Deeper holes (12 ft) downstream past the scattered rocks that fish tend to congregate in during winter. In current and lowlight hours these walleyes move upwards into the shallower (7 to 8 feet)rocks, and also near an adjacent currentswept flat which the walleyes cruise the edge of in lowlight or cloudy days.

Casting 1/16 oz jig after 1/16 oz jig with minnows into the rocky areas, the edges of flats, etc.. at lowlight caused a major headache with these fish. The familiar "tick" was felt in which you would assume the minnow had been eaten and the head turned,you'd see the line moving and feel the fish on-yet at hookset all I'd do is yank in a jig with a chewed up minnow. Obviously the hook wasn't setting- so what are the fish doing with this minnow, right? Lost 3 fish before I finally got smart here.
So I worked the same areas with a 16 oz jig/minnow under a float to get a better visual of exactly what was going on and finally you could see the bite. Float goes down 3/4 of the way..... leans to a side and spins in a circle a few times, keeps moving erratically before it SLOWLY and diagonally went all the way down as it got further away from the currentswept rocks and away from the dropoff. Set the hook this time, missed it again and the minnow was stripped after reeling it in. Tried the same routine, peeled out line and gave it a few seconds longer and the 17 inch walleye was finally hooked after the float was submerged for 4 seconds and the fish actually bit down on the jig.
My guess is that these fish were picking the minnows/baitfish off from around the submerged rocks or edges of the flat, then taking the minnow down to a deeper spot to actually eat it. In this case setting the hook at first "tick" didnt help as all they were doing was holding the bait in their mouths and turning their heads to swim away with it. At the turn of the head the fish still wasn't hooked as was mentioned in some of the previous posts.

Maybe we have some weird walleyes here in Illinois, but the only way to get them this past weekend was to feed them line and let them take their time with the bait.

[s.f.]

your stratagy might have been right on for that given situation. BUT...i wonder if you'd open the hook gap of the jig a little if your original hooksetting plan would improve? and those rocks you talk of almost every cast dull the hook a little, so stay on that part too. as i said earlier, most of the time, it is the presentation that prevents the fish from getting all of it right away. not the fishes intentions or mood.
great stuff to THINK about!

#49

[Tom (N.W.Ont)]

Thanks for the input boys! Great thread!

-T