lead core line?

[hog tye-er]

what size lead core is best for lake erie trolling? is 36lb too heavy? and what is advantage of lead core over snap weights, dipsys downriggers etc. I plan on trying leadcore as I've heard it has advantages but would appreciate any help on subject thankx in advance.

[RTD]

I use 18lb lead core with a 10lb. mono leader. I keep one trolling rod rigged with lead core for use straight out the back of the boat. I use it mainly when there are a lot of depth changes.

[Gary Gray]

I agree with RTD, I use it straight off the back of the boat. It will follow contours better. When open water trolling, such as on Erie, Snap weights are usually the best solution to getting lure to a deeper depth than the lure will go on it's own.

Good Luck,
Gary Gray

[Water Dog]

To really understand lead core pick up a Precision Trolling Guide 5th addition page 28 . Lead core catches fish in the top 35 fow very well . Downriggers are required when you need to go much deeper .
If you are running both (downriggers with lures between 15 an 40fow , we like to use planer boards with the lead line to avoid tangles .
Some days we run lead core on planer boards , dipsey's , flat lines , and downriggers for outstanding verticle water depth coverage .
Lead core can be a cost effective , low tech system for catching hard to reach fish . We have been slamming the browns trolling lead core along the beach in as little as 10-15fow .
Best Regards ,
Water Dog

[SUPERTROLLER]

18 lb. and 36 lb. leadcore uses the same weight of lead. Only the lb. test rating of the dacron line is different. 18 lb. is the most common used because it has more lead than the smaller rated leadcores and is still strong enough for most uses. Tie on your mono leaders using Uni-to-Uni knots.

[Reels]

I also put a drop of superglue on the knot to bond it together.

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[figkms]

What would be the difference in depth one might achieve with the same lure when using different weight variations of leadcore line, say using 12lb., 15lb., 18lb., and 27lb. leadcore line? IE. Would the same lure using 12lb. versus 18lb. leadcore run at the same or a different depth. Consider all other factors a constant (boat speed, ect.).

Thanks for sharing your experiences!:)

[figkms]

Back to the top, still looking for those with experience willing to share their thoughts on my question regarding lure depth with different leadcore line weights. See post number 6 of mine. Thanks in advance.:)

[Gumbo]

Most leadcore lines have the same amount of lead, whether it's 18# or heavier. So the lighter line is preferred since it has the same amount of lead, less dacron, and is plenty strong (at least for the fish I catch). So the answer is to use the lighter leadcore to maximize depth.

[figkms]

Sorry to beat up this question, but am really looking to understand the leadcore trolling technique and learn from those in the know. I am trying to determine which weight of leadcore line would work best for what I'm attempting to accomplish, getting the maximum depth from my lures and yet get the most line possible on a reel spool.

It was once explained to me that a rule of thumb to use with 18lb. leadcore was that each length of line (a 10ft. color), that the lure would gain about 5 ft. in depth. Is this rule of thumb correct?

I know that there are other factors in the equation (boat speed, ect.) and I'm not concerned with those other influences, but wish to know if I were to use 12lb. leadcore would the lure gain the same 5ft. of depth as the 18lb. leadcore, or would it run deeper or higher in the water column. In another example if one used 27lb. leadcore what depth would the same lure gain or lose versus the 18lb. leadcore. Will heavier weight leadcore cause the lure to run deeper than lighter weight leadcore line, or is it like mono the heavier weight, bigger diameter line won't allow the lure to run as deep. I read the post that the lead is the same weight and diameter in all leadcore just the nylon is differnet thus the reasons for the different line weights. So how does the different line weights affect depth?

Anyone with any specifics on how the same lure with the same length of line out would vary in depth using 12lb., 15lb., 18lb., and 27lb. leadcore weight line would be appreciated. If possible an example of the various depths by line weight (per leadcore 10ft. color length of line) would be helpful.

[Water Dog]

We use 18 lb core because it has less water resistance (it's thinner)and has the SAME amount of lead as 27 and 36 lb ; so we find 18 lb will troll deeper !

Lead core is HIGHLY speed dependent .

Speed thru the water will effect your depth more than any other factor .

You will NEVER predict the exact depth of core because speed on top can vary greatly from what is going on below .

One day I put on swim fins and a mask to watch the lures as the parade of downrigger lures , flat lines and lead core went by .

The lead core undulated up and down as it went by while everything else cruised by at a fairly level depth .
Sorry to be so long winded,
Water Dog

[Dave S]

For a given weight of line, the larger the outside diameter of the line the greater the drag of the water on the line pushing the line upward as it is pulled through the water. The 12 lb line will run slightly deeper than the 24 lb line as the 12 lb line will have a slightly smaller outside diameter. To complicate issues, lead core outside diameters can vary slightly between manufactures of the same test of line but "this is really splitting hairs so to speak".

Boat speed is far more of an important variable than whether the line is 12, 18, or 24 lb. Per the "Trollers Handbook" one color of leadcore sinks at 5.5' at 2 mph (very common trolling speed), 6' at 1.8 mph, 7' at 1.5 mph, 8' at 1.2 mph, 10' at 1.0 mph, 12' at 0.8 mph, and 17' at 0.5 mph.

[SUPERTROLLER]

Dave, I believe you are mistaking his question on leadcore for a diameter question with regular line. 12 lb. leadcore will weigh less than 18 lb. leadcore and will therefore run HIGHER in the water column depending upon how much line is let out. Once the weight of the 18 lb. line out is great enough to overcome the minute disparity in line diameter the 18 lb. will run deeper. Think of it like a 1 oz. snap weight vs. a 2 oz. snapweight. Even on 12 lb. line vs. 18 lb. line there will not be enough "lift" on the 18 lb. diameter to overcome the increased weight of the 2 oz. weight.

[Dave S]

Suppertroller, For a given line diameter, a heavier weight lead core would definitely run deeper as you indicate . However if the leadcore diameter is constant, the smaller diameter line would run deeper. Guess I am not sure if leadcore on the 18 lb line is heavier than the 12 lb or whether the difference in line strength is due to a heavier outer covering. Maybe someone has some 12 lb leadcore and can mic the leadcore and outer line diameter. For 15 lb lead core, the Troller'S Handbook indicates the outline diameter is typically 0.025" with a lead core of 0.016" diameter. I have some 18 lb Cabellas leadcore and will check out its outer diameter and diameter of the leadcore.

[Nick]

>To really understand lead core pick up a Precision Trolling
>Guide 5th addition page 28 . Lead core catches fish in the
>top 35 fow very well . Downriggers are required when you
>need to go much deeper .
>If you are running both (downriggers with lures between 15
>an 40fow , we like to use planer boards with the lead line
>to avoid tangles .
>Some days we run lead core on planer boards , dipsey's ,
>flat lines , and downriggers for outstanding verticle water
>depth coverage .
>Lead core can be a cost effective , low tech system for
>catching hard to reach fish . We have been slamming the
>browns trolling lead core along the beach in as little as
>10-15fow .
>Best Regards ,
>Water Dog

[Nick]

I too am trying to learn leadcore and my question is why would
you use lead core in the depth of 10-15ft like you are for browns.
I thought you want to use lead core to get down deep?
An explanation would be appreciated.
Thanks

[Dave S]

Got out the Venier Calipers and measured several brands and weights of leadcore line.
18 lb Cabelas, Outside line Dia. 0.028", lead core 0.017";
27 lb Cabelas, Outside line Dia. 0.028", lead core 0.017";
18 lb Western Filament, Outside line Dia. 0.025", lead core 0.019";
15 lb Western Filament, Outside line Dia. 0.024", lead core 0.019"

Measuring the diameter of the braid is understandably difficult due to the compressible nature of the braided line. It appears to me that each line manufacture tends to use the same lead core diameter for various line weights changing only the amount of outside braid to change the line breaking strength. Variations in leadcore diameter appear to be present from one leadcore line manufacturer to the other. For a given line manufacturer, I would expect minimal differences in sinking rate between 12 lb - 27 lb line as the leadcores appear to be the same with minute differences in outer line diameter. Line speed through the water is much more of a consideration than leadcore line weight.

[figkms]

Thank you all for sharing your knowledge.:)

I know with leadcore the boat speed is the most critical factor in determining depth, but assume I leave this out of the equation, from the posts listed I am reading and understanding that 12lb. leadcore and 27lb. leadcore would have the same weight and diameter of lead if they were to come from the same manufacturer. I would assume using the lead factors (weight & diameter) alone the lures would then achieve the same depth. Now when I add the outer covering (braid) into the equation, with its main purpose of providing the line its breaking strength, I come up with the theory that the 27lb. leadcore would run higher in the water column than the 12lb. leadcore because it would have greater resistence due the larger diameter of the outer covering (braid).

If this is true, I would choose the 12lb. leadcore to achieve my goal of a lure being able to run deeper and maxiumize the amount of leadcore on my reel spool.

Have I interperted everyone's posts correctly? Please followup with confirmation or correct my thinking. Thanks in advance.:)

[SUPERTROLLER]

Yes, you are interpreting the postings correctly. This is only if 12 lb. and 27 lb. have the same weight of lead in them.

From everything I have read and seen from others, I do not believe this to be true. Dave went and measured 15 lb. leadcore and assumed it has the same diameter/weight of lead as 12 lb. I don't believe this to be true. I will agree that the 15 lb. and 18 lb. he measured had the same lead but to my knowledge most manufacturers use a heavier leadcore starting at the 18 lb. level. This is why the 18 lb. is so popular. You gain the most weight with the least line diameter with enough strength to handle the job at hand. Compare the weights listed on a package of leadcore next time your looking, the smaller diameter will have a substantially lower weight. The line diameter will not add enough weight to 18 or 27 lb. test line to be of significant difference. I think Dave means well here but he's jumping to conclusions with the 12 lb. test = 27 lb. test statement. It just ain't true.

[Dave S]

Based on the above line measurements, I would concur with your theory. The other factor that hasn't been discussed is the "Snag" Factor. For pulling lures in tree infested reservoirs or snag infested rivers you may be breaking off large section of your 12 lb lead core unless you utilize a leader with less than 12 lb breaking strength. For very snaggy rivers for instance, it is common to use a 20 lb leader and 26 lb lead core just so you have a chance of getting back some of those expensive crankbaits. For reservoirs with next to no snags you can probrably do ok with the lighter leadcore. What I am saying is that in opinion, there is a place for a variety of lead core weights depending on the number of anticipated snags.

[Dave S]

Looking on the back of the Cabelas Lead Core package they show a trolling depth chart. For 12 through 45 pound line they do not differentiate any changes in depth for 1, 2, or 3 colors of leadcore dependent on line weight.

In the case of the 18 and 27 pound Cabelas lead core line I measured, the internal leadcore had the same diameter. I do not have any 12 lb leadcore to measure so can not say what diameter it might have.

[figkms]

Thanks to all for your posts to my question. I am certainly more educated:) on leadcore now than when I started, and I thank you for that.

[Mike S]

I have ran 15lb line and 18lb line side by side and found that I
needed more line out with 15lb. I don't remember the differance for
sure but I beleive it was 15 to 20 feet.I now have all my rods with
18lb for consistency.

[MLD]

If you pick up equal length spools of Cabelas 12lb and 18lb leadcore you can easily tell that the 18lb is definitely heavier. The weight of an 18lb spool compared to a 27lb spool feels equal though.

Mike

[Water Dog]

Lead core is not my prefered method to go deep . It is a great fish catcher in the top 10 thru 40 fow depths .
Why ?
A quote from the Precision Trolling Guide states it best ;
(Being of low strech , lead core line is quite sensitive and allows SOLID hook-ups .
Because of it's weight , lead core does not form the same "bow" in the line that mono does .
In fact , lead core even forms a slight "droop" in the line .
We might even theorize that the downward weight of the line imparts a slight back pressure on a lure that has been inhaled by a fish .
This might even promote an instinctive "hang on " reflex that reduces the likihood of lure rejection before impact .
This may partially account for the effectiveness of slow lead core trolling , which is otherwise difficult to explain .)
All I know is lead core has been a fantastic tool to catch fish in the top 40fow and we have been doing well using it in the shallow 10 - 25fow shore and structure areas of the lake .
Best Regards ,
Water Dog

[Water Dog]

With 60-90 ft of leader and 8.6 ft med light action rods , core is great in shallow water conditions .
Trolling for browns , kings , jacks , and walleyes along beaches , rock walls, or other structure has produced many fish with only two color segments out of the reel .
So you reel in 60 ft of core , the rest is mono ! The fight is great !
This method can really produce in 10 - 25 fow .
Few people are fishing the shallows , but believe me the action can get hot .
The big boats shy away from these shallow spots ; less competion and fishing pressure .
For a small boat , two lead core rigs can be a low cost alternative to down riggers and allow them outstanding action in under fished shallow water applications .
Best Regards .
Water Dog