Our real job post, anyone not a manager?

[Bob W.]

Just read the post, "Our Real Jobs". Wow, is anyone out there not a director, manager, or superintendent? I'm embarrassed to post my mundane job!!!!!

[Shellback]

I hear ya, I'm a equipment operator for a heavy highway contractor in S.E. PA. I was wondering how all these guys had 20,000 to 40,000 dollar boats?

[rock2me]

Why would you be embarrased? Are you a pimp or what? ;)

It is interesting that people like to compare their job to others - and of course the commensurate dollars. Life is too short to worry about the other guy. If you are happy with your job and it is paying the bills, be happy! If you are not happy you should start loking for something else.

I could change jobs for more money, however, I enjoy my flex time. I put the kids on the bus every morning and my wife is home early to greet them after school.

My garbage man probably makes more money then I, but then again I do not want to be a garbage man. Nothing against garbage men, it's just not for me. I'm glad there are morticians, they make a lot of money, not for me though.

I have a friend that is a manual laborer and you will never catch him down-playing himself. He does quality work, he knows it and his customers know it. He is very comfortable talking and dealing with some of the richest homeowners in the twin cities. There is nothing to be ashamed over making an honest living.

Yes,.....I'll include it. Network Analyst for a huge corporation(tiny cog in the big machine). I was in a small company for the flexibility and it got purchased, then got purchased again. I have been able to keep my hours so here I am grinnin'

Good Luck!

[Hooky]

I work for the County highway department on highway maintenance. Although it is somewhat unorganized at times, I do work four ten hour days in the summer with Friday, Saturday, and Sunday off. To me that is worth all the money in the world. [sometimes]

[ebijack]

i'm not a manger, etc, etc...even with my backround (post 173?), everyone in the shop i work in is considered "just the kitchen help". i've cleaned bars, washed dishes,and many other jobs over the years. there has to be folks willing and able to do the hundereds of jobs that it takes to make AMERICA what it is..the land of the FREE! be proud your able to do what you can.

[tj1n]

I found this very interesting as well. I am the mgr. of a regional freight company and love the demands/competition level at which I'm required to perform at. I'm not a highly paid mgr. and yes I do wish for more......as do most fishmermen I believe.

I own a boat which isn't worth anymore than 10k as that is all I can currently afford in my current financial/family status. I recently posted the financial survey and over 75% of the people on this board made over 60K annually and also owned boats over 25K, this astounds me. However, does it make me feel like less of a person because my salary and boat aren't of the same financial value of the majority of the peeps that post on this site? NOT A CHANCE!

If you think someone with a "MGR" title is anything more then you? Then you need to make the difference or change for your own satisfaction. I don't consider myself any better or stronger person then those that I manage or associate with.....matter of fact, my best friends that I hunt and fish the most with are guys that are LABORERS. Many days I wish I had their jobs.... However, whenever you are satisfied with what you have or how you do something, you will probably become stagnant and no longer improve or grow. Keep striving to be all that you can be.....no matter what your dreams are!

Someday I'll have that boat, maybe even 50-100 rods (as many on this board claim to have) if that is my desire.....but for now I will continue to be happy with what I have as this is what my efforts have produced. Yea some people are handed fortune, those of us that have to earn it, will know how to appreciate.

TJ

[Go Fer]

Hi, I'm a grunt. I just do what I am told to do. But I bet I can do it better than you!

[Laker]

I teach CADD, GIS and coach baseball at a community college in NW Iowa. In my spare time, when I'm not recruiting I fish as much as I can. I've only posted afew times, but i do enjoy the valuable info on this site.

[mudpuppy]

I'm with you Bob W.. I think this board is about people sharing a common interest & ideas . Don't really care if someone works at the carwash or is a rocket scientist . I think caddyshack had the right idea .

[Lund Angler]

No manager here either, and I wouldn't want the extreme mental work load;or the hour's at a terminal. I've been a Cable TV. tecnician for 23 year's and I'm proud to bring all of you guy's the fishin' show's you love. Yes it's a job many people don't think about,unless you have a problem.I've worked any and every holiday as many people are in their home's enjoying family and friend's as we keep it going. I've fished out of a boat that my Dad bought from the mill that was used to paint barges.I've moved up as anyone could,and should.Now it's a Lund.Only own 10 or so rod's.So what. It's much like age-It's a state of mind.

[Reels]

Being a manager dosent make my hooks any sharper....

And the fish could care less.


<{{}}><

[Gary]

I am an aircraft mechanic up here in Canada. My boat was bought new in 1999, it's not a PRO-V, or a Triton, or a Ranger just a LUND model similiar to a REBEL for the Canadian market. (personally I think it has a better layout than the Rebel, but on a semi-v hull.) I make good money, wifey works part time, live in a side by side, mortgage is small, have 3 squares a day, (I should cut down to 2!) Our fishing equipment is nothing overly expensive, tho I do insist on any reel should have a least 4 bearings in it. We buy tackle out of the clearance bins, scarred to use my new 6" Rapala Husky Jerk for fear of losing it. I don't believe a $600 reel on a equally expensive rod makes you a better fisherman, tho I would like to learn how to troll properly and use the trolling motor to better advantage. I would like a bigger boat because we take a lot of people fishing for the fun of it. I would like a new fish finder because mine lies. i would like to fish like the professionals, have the knowledge, and TIME! But I listen to others, try out their suggestions, but always resort back to a pickeral rig. (Hey! Don't laugh! Have caught Channel cat-31", sturgeon-29", walleyes-31", fresh drum-24", Pike-30" just out of the Red River alone!) OH! Fishing rods! We have lots! Bought over the years most expensive was for a 9 foot, 70 bucks I think.

Managers are people too, they have their problems just like you and me, wishes and desires like you and me, but if they don't fish, well....

[Atomic Eye]

Bob W.,

No matter what your job is, I guarantee that if you caught sumo eyes with consistency, nearly everyone on this board would pay homage to you. If you didn't catch them consistently, most on this board would accept you with brotherhood to fish side by side. This board is not about who earns what with what education. It's about fishing and sharing ideas about it and even other topics. It's also about "talking" about what interests you in fishing.

Atomic Eye (New Mexico) -- "Gone Fission!" ~~~<}}}:>

[RANGER]

You know, whatever any of us do we are all Walleye Fisherpeople! Does it really matter where any of us stand when standing next to each other on a dock or in a line waiting to buy bait, or sitting in a restaurant having breakfast?? I don't think so!! It is a mundane and worn out expression BUT we ALL put our pants on one leg at a time. That is a fact, and beyond that WHO CARES??

I don't see any of the regular contributors, on this site, holding back info for any that ask! That sez alot!

I will contribute what I can as do the majority of us, so, what's the diff??? If you are happy with your life NO ONE has a right to judge!

[Gilligan]

To speak my mind and not be a yes man, therefore I received a 'signifigant incentive' to leave my job as a machine shop foreman some 15+ years ago. I now run a precision CNC grinder, make more money than my boss and work fewer hours, and don't have to listen to EI'S (educated idiots)

I LOOK forward to full time job fishing. (retirement not going pro)

WHO wants to talk shop anyhow? Go fish!

[Gilligan]

Good post Ranger Bob. Tried to email you awhile back but your old address I have dosen't work.

[RANGER]

Gilligan,

Shoot it over this connection here (the icons)! If it fails, e-mail me at ranger_rfd@yahoo.com

[RANGER]

HEARD the EI thing!! I get SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooo pissed by these "folks" ( I have better names for them) that THINK they KNOW what they think they know and have their heads' up their a$$ further then my boat can run on a full tank!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't appreciate them, much less tolerate them! If I did I would be working in Baltimore or NYC - Oh, what a thrill!!!!

[Curious]

With that being said, why are so many so eager to brag up their Big Shot backgrounds? I thought this was a fishing sight?

[RANGER]

It's very simple - the question was asked! Should we change what we do/are to accommodate your interests???????????????

Besides, this is the "General Discussion" forum! Anything can be presented and discussed.

[Curious]

Sure would be nice to see that many responses towards your fishing questions.

[RANGER]

I'm happy with the responses and I don't have a problem.

[Atomic Eye]

Curious,

Yes, it'd be great to get that many responses to all of our fishing questions. But, maybe a lot of the folks here don't have experience with the exact, specific question, e.g., what do you think of erie Dearies on Lake XXX? Two of the most responded to questions that I've seen recently were:
1. Where are you from? - Gosh, we all know this.
2. What do you do? - Again, gosh, we all know this.

About the only thing you could get more responses to is: can you spell your name?

When you read a lot of the responses here, you frequently see "IMO" or "IMHO." There's a lot of humility exhibited here. The posts rarely try to belittle anyone and are monitored. If you interpret this one that way, maybe it's time to look within? As Lao Tsu said, "The further outside you go, the less you know."

I hope that most people are happy with what they do. If not, they have the responsibility to try to change it to something better.

Atomic Eye (New Mexico) -- "Gone Fission!" ~~~<}}}:>

[rickn]

As I posted in the other thread, I'm a combine mechanic, have been for 27 years. Are others smarter than me? I don't think so, only schooled for something else. I love my job, and will proably die there. I could do better other places, but I have a free rein to do as I wish, and thats worth a million!

[TBO/MN]

In real terms, I guess I manage 30 9 year olds for 7 hours a day. Other than that I am just a guy that goes to work every day, work my butt off, mostly with my mind, and hope that I have made a difference to someone. When all is said and done, I feel good about what I do, and have enjoyed it for 26 years. I love to teach people about anything and everything I know.... but better than those folks, nope!

Like the others have said, I have worked at just about everything, from a clerk in a paint store, to an apprentice pipefitter, should have stuck with that, I would be making more money. I also worked as a grease monkey, changing oil in huge diesel engines for Ottertail Power Co....well somebody had to do it, and it paid for college.

Am I educated, yup, but that is what I do, and the state of Minnesota says I have to continue to go to college, to keep my license. The last 17 years I have not missed more than 2 semesters in a row without going to college, and have enjoy the heck out of it...but again, that's what I do.

It all comes down to what you do to make the mortgage payment, put food on the table, and raise your family. I chose to do it this way, doesn't make me more or less than anyone else.

We all love to fish, how we make the money to do it.......really doesn't matter. I just manage to get throught the day, like everyone else.

Good Fishin'
TBO/MN

[AquaMan]

No manager here. Just a simple computer salesman by day and a carpenter by nights/weekends.

AquaMan~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Just turning cash into water!

[SUPERTROLLER]

I didn't know anyone could mix up my position as Operator of a Wastewater plant with being the CEO in charge of something important. I manage to bring home a paycheck every couple of weeks just like the next guy. It's all equal when they jump in the boat. They all put their rainpants on one leg at a time.

[Den]

What do you call a real job? a real job to me is what ever you are doing, and enjoying it, and making a decent living is a good job. i worked a job that i didnt really like, but it paid the bills, and made a good living at it , but i hated going in everyday. i did that for thirty years, then retired.i had good insurance, and good pay, but i did not enjoy it. i reccommend any young person to find a job that they enjoy, no matter what it is. money isnt everything, but you gotta make enough to pay the bills. if it be a high paying job, and you enjoy it, great. i now have a tackle shop, i dont make enough in it to make a living, but i enjoy it more than anything i have done. i meet all kinds of people, and they are all fishermen, and sportsmen of all kinds. the one post stated, thats what being free is about, and ebi, i agree all the way. thats what america is all about. we can all agree about one thing, we do like to fish. good luck and good fishin.
Den

[Atomic Eye]

SuperTroller,

But, you are a CEO - you're in charge of protecting your plant's discharges to make sure the water & environment are protected & you meet the legal requirements. I'll bet you also make sure that there are no noxious chlorine gas leaks to poison the neighborhood kids or robins? And you're a "farmer" to make sure that all those little organisms eat up all the organic goodies (s$$t, nitrates, + more) your state environment dept says can't be released from your plant.

Haven't we all selected (by choice or inadvertent circumstance) a niche to make the whole thing work?

We all put our crawlers on our bottom bouncer hooks one hook at a time, right? (Concerning an earlier post - I've never gut hooked an eye on a bottom bouncer with a spinner hook rig!)

Atomic Eye (New Mexico) -- "Gone Fission!" ~~~<}}}:>

[the legend]

I have the most important job of all, I am the father of a beautiful little girl,Emily. Emily is severely handicapped and won't be around forever. for the first few years of her life I put my fishing poles away because i didn't want to miss a minute of her life. well she's 5.5 (3 years older than ever expected)and I'm getting the poles back out. This part of my job makes me happy, the part of my job that pays the bills is the cement finishing/laborering. I have 112 hours of mechanical engineering but quit school because i knew i would never be happy behind a desk.

[SUPERTROLLER]

I'm an Operator. I don't manage anyone but myself. I run the plant the way it needs to be to keep things on an even keel. I let the Bosses go home with the ulcers about compliance with our discharge parameters. I go home and worry about getting to the boat launch tomorrow with my fishing equipment and a couple bottles of pop.

[Gumbo]

I still think it's a dang interesting post. The people who contribute here are this site's greatest asset. And that post helps us get to know each other better. I wish everybody could post a picture of themselves too.

[fishy1]

Lund angler I hope that youve beeen practicin youre cpr cause bad ice cold temps and big fish on tv are causin people to pass out everywhere and I only have ten channels to choose from .OH by the way I'm just a laborer in a small company but sponsership is just about every fisherpersons dream>No manager here either, and I wouldn't want the extreme
>mental work load;or the hour's at a terminal. I've been a
>Cable TV. tecnician for 23 year's and I'm proud to bring all
>of you guy's the fishin' show's you love. Yes it's a job
>many people don't think about,unless you have a problem.I've
>worked any and every holiday as many people are in their
>home's enjoying family and friend's as we keep it going.
>I've fished out of a boat that my Dad bought from the mill
>that was used to paint barges.I've moved up as anyone
>could,and should.Now it's a Lund.Only own 10 or so rod's.So
>what. It's much like age-It's a state of mind.

[CJW]

Geeze guys lighten up I'm just a lowly farmer, but if I didn't do my job none of you could do yours!!! You'd be working all day to just get enough to eat for you and your families. And if the iron workers and machinery manufacturers don't do theirs, I'd be out there hanging too. The same goes with every job here! If the crane operator doesn't do his job the foreman and the ceo have nothing too. Funny how we're all dependant on what each other does isn't it! Just my lowly 2 cents! Now lawyers there's a place I can say, oh never mind. Just kidding! :-) Craig

[Rudy]

I got some jobs for you. I am an Executive Director, a full time sportscaster on a 100,000 watt radio station(this is strictly an evening job) and I guide all fall on the weekends for hunting. This is to pay for my hobbies of fishing and hunting.
Remember, a job is only good if you like going to it every day. Regardless of the money you make, if you like it, it is a good job to have.

Rudy

[Marble Eyes]

I ams what I ams.

I work to Live, NOT live to work.

Besides Management it an overrated Headache. Been there, done that.

[KP]

HELP MR. WIZARD, I DON'T WANT TO BE A MANAGER ANYMORE!!!

But I have no choice. Nine years ago I was divorced in Minnesota. The laws there do not permit me to seek employment lower than my "earning potential". I earn a good salary but I don't live anywhere near it. The governments and insurances get 28% and my ex gets 35%, after tax, and all medical/dental. And she's the one who left me for her high school sweetheart's with my kids. I love Minnesota but I HATE THE STATE OF MINNESOTA!

I enjoy the challenges of my job, but I'm tired of spending most of my life in planes, hotel rooms and eating restaurant food. Not to mention having a little concern for the next Radical who wants to bring down a plane for Bin Laden. I have been lucky to have staffs of people who work with me and make my job much easier. I love working in the nuclear industry but I'd give anything to be back in the field where all the real action is.

Thank God I've now got a wonderful wife who likes to fish, and great kids who continue to love and respect their Father. And of course my little Lund Rebel and 30 HP motor. It's not a Mr. Pike or Tyee but it's MY boat and my solitude.

[GOS]

Been a freight conductor, in the midwest for 27+ years. No glory- long hours, days/nights, weekends, holidays, graduations, tied down to when the phone rings. Currently have a 6 days on, 3 days off work schedule, so yes, I can get away. Hoping to make it to retirement, in 13 years. But you know what- I wouldn't change a thing! Many people think the grass is greener, on the other side, it's not!

[ChuckD]

I don't have a job, but I have a great wife who is a Doctor and she buys me a new Ranger boat every year for my birthday. All I have to do is take care of the kids, pay bills, care for the house and arrange for the nanny to watch the kids when I feel like hopping in the boat to go fishing. Oh, I live on Leech Lake too.

DOOOOP! I was dreaming again! I'm back to reality now. I work all day to barely support my fishing habits. I love my job in the criminal justice field (top secret, shhh).

[ADO]

Dear Mr. Legend, You are my hero!!!

[BIG AL]

Hats off to you buddy! Keep up the good work... ><> ><> ><> AL

[NC]

Financial advisor. I hear and believe all the stories about "how money isn't everything" and thank God that is true because the market has taken all of mine. I may be sleeping in my Lund pretty soon:)
Have a good weekend.
NC

[Peluso]

I'm not! ;) Good fishing and don't forget to shoot the puck. Mike Peluso #999

[Tom B]

I am a part time UPS'er, part time boat sales guy and I edit a muskie magazine. I did what I needed to do to be home with my 2 daughters before they started school. Now, I am waiting to bid a full time job at UPS so that my wife can do the "part time job, be involved in the kids activities and take care of the house" thing. So far, it's been a good thing.

Tom B

[iamwalleye1]

I would like to say that I manage the house when the wife is not home!!

[nosnoots]

I am an oil boy for the Tropicana swim suit team. :)

nosnoots

(Computer Broker dealing in Compaq. If any of you are IT managers and need gear.....I will toss in a couple of crank baits:) hehe)

[EyeJacker]

Been there, done that! Let me give you directions to Wisconsin. :)
Jack

[Mushroom]

I work at a boat factory. Grinding fiberglass and sniffing styrene so you all can go fishing on the weekends. Thank God the wife has a real job.

[risor39]

I'm a millrat and as for finding a job you like I'll be willing to bet over 50% don't enjoy their jobs.Get over it, if work was so enjoyable everybody would be doing it.Not that I don't put in a hard days work now and then.Thats one of the reasons I love fishing so much,just to get away from it all.One of the last things I will ask is where you work.One of the first things is do you fish.A friend of mine told me you can't have everything where would you put it?

[JMC]

I don't think you can get to know someone by learning their job title. People are too judgmental about this. To me asking someone what they do is "small talk" to pass time. Your job title is not who or what you are, it's what you do to make a living. My "real job" is to take care of my family the best I can. People come to this board for a common interest, the one's that impress us the most here are the one's who help others improve themselves. A title cannot do this. I like to leave the job at work.

[eek]

I work in corrections, work 14 12 hour shifts per month. My work schedule allows me lots of days off, but dosen't pay too much. I started my married life off 15 years ago with a wonderful woman, a big mortgage and a burning desire to succeed. After all this while, my wife is still with me, my stepson is 20 years old, and going great, we have paid off the house, and are now starting to enjoy the life that we have worked for.

[Anonymous]

I read all the posts. I post a lot on here so I am going to withhold my name for this one because I am going to share very personal perspectives about my own life.

I am 55 years old now ... or nearly. I kiddlingly tell my friends that I must have committed a horrible crime when I was 5 ... because I just spent 50 years sentenced to hard labor. 16 in a school system that I found of little value and which did not prepare me for much of what real life brought. 4 in "Uncle Sam's Mother's Crotch" ... "SEMPER FI" ... two of which had some nasty little people trying their best to kill my young a*s. 30 chained to a desk in Corporate America that, in retrospect, taught me that posturing/smooth-talking/manipulating were rewarded and that hard work/knowledge/commitment/honesty were not.

The only thing that kept me going during those 30 corporate years as I learned to play the game was the fact that I had a plan ... a plan to retire by 55. Yup ... I did play the game ... and I spent a lot of sleepless nights worrying about political struggles and how to do the right thing when other people were only in the game for themselves. And I did make it to the top ... well, close enough for me, anyway.

The best days of my life so far have been the day my "freedom bird" took off after my 2nd tour, the day I married my wife, and the day I turned in my early retirement notice. In between, I did the best I could with the few weeks of vacation I had each year, worked at keeping a positive perspective on life, and kept resolutely working towards retirement.

That retirement was 7 months ago. I am finally free. And I feel like a little kid inside. I love my life ... I have spent the last 7 months hunting, dog training, and fishing. Took me a long time to get here ... but I now enjoy each and every day. As I tell my buddies ... "My worst day of retirement has been better than my best day at work". They tell me that I am so happy it is disgusting. My wife tells me the smile that is perpetually on my face says it all.

Why did I stick with it? The last 10 years were because I could see the light at the end of the tunnel. The first 10 were because I did not know any better. The middle 10 ... well, I guess I felt trapped and did not have the courage to get out of the rat race because I didn't know what else to do.

Would I do it again? Nope. You guys that found jobs that you like were smarter than me. Or maybe you had more courage. Or maybe I was just too stubborn to say enough is enough and to look for an easier path. I am not sure where I read it ... but one of the books I read said someting like "Most of us live lives of quiet desperation". I guess I figured what I was going through was normal. Studies done in the U.S. seem to confirm that most people are in the same boat I was in.

But, this boy is free now. And he ain't ever goin' back!

[EyeJacker]

People are judgemental, no doubt, however, I believe that small talk is what fuels a cohesive society. It is the way you get to know someone. One's vocation does tell you something of that person, unfortunately, some have to assign a positive or negative value to it. Every post to this board, all "small talk", tells you something of the author. I find it interesting to see what various authors on this board do for a living, it does tend to sharpen the impression we all form of an individual. The error would be to believe that this impression, formed on less than all the facts, is indeed who that person is. A rather shallow thought prosess, I know, but all to many of us are guilty of just that! I believe that any and all gainful employment is honorable! What difference does it really make who does what! Every viable job requires someone to perform it, from (A)tomic fission (sorry Atomic Eye, but I just couldn't resist) to (Ze)bra manufacturing, ahhh, better make that husbandry. I do believe you have your priorities straight about taking care of the family, although I'm not sure I would describe it as a "job", maybe a labor of love. :)

Jack

[Guest]

I'm going to post this without my real name as well because this is the first time I've disagreed with almost every post on this board. I don't think a job title tells who you are by any means, but those of us who think work has to suck or be a pain in the butt aren't doing what they love. I absolutely love going to work (most days) because of so many reasons. Now maybe that's because I like the competitive environment or maybe its because I truly enjoy selling. Either way, I've found that most who don't like their jobs and complain about "corporate america" never had the stones to make a change and take a chance. You never hear of anyone succeeding, whether it be Bill Gates or Gary Roach, saying "boy I wasn't doing anything and this opportunity just fell in my lap". That's crap. I understand there are circumstances which dictate some of the choices we make, however I still believe we have choices each and everyday. The thing that gets me is how many people on this board have the mentality that "work is just something I do to pay the bills". If that is the case, then I do feel sorry for you because you've spent a long part of your life being unhappy. Again, this isn't about money or power because quite frankly I have neither, but I guess I'm just sick of the "poor working man" sob story I've been reading on all of these posts about being "smarter or more experienced" than some college educated younger guy but being screwed by the white collars. I'm sure I pissed most people off here which is why I chose to keep my name a secret, for the most part I've always agreed with this board. But I'm sorry to say this is one issue I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on.

[EyeJacker]

Well said!
Jack

"Life is like a box of Chocolates" Forest Gump

[anonymous]

Spoken exactly like I would have spoken it during my first 10 years.

[anonymous]

Thanks, Jack. It was not an easy thing to open up and share that. But, if it helps anyone with their perspective and their life's journey, then good.

[Couldn't agree more.]

Well put. This is America. If someone doesn't like their job, quit whining and take the necessary steps to change. Yes, maybe you'll have to go back to school at night or weekends and maybe miss some fishing time or other play time, but quit whining. Everybody's tired of hearing it. I have friends that are street sweepers for the town and other that are doctors. What they have in common is that they are satisified with their place in life and they are good people to be around. Nobody wants to be around someone who bit*ches about their job but doesn't have the ambition to do something about it. That is, except for others that want to whine and feel sorry for themselves too.

[anonymous]

I have to put in an additional reply to your rather intolerant post.

No, I was not in the same league as Bill Gates. However I certainly was not "waiting for something to fall into my lap" as your post implied. I made things happen in our company and gained a reputation as THE "go to" guy ... the words of my peers and subordinates, not mine. I started near the bottom of our ladder and finished as a Director for my company. That is in the top 20 out of 1200 employees and I reported directly to the Executive Team ... the top five people in the organization. And this is despite my very deliberate and conscious decision to refuse to become one of the manipulative self-promoting versions of the white-collar force.

My comments were my reflection on "corporate America" after working for 5 different companies over 30 years. I know that face of America very well. Two of those companies I worked for less than 2 years each because I did have "the stones" to try to make things happen ... and the courage to move on when I realize it never would happen there.



My comments were also to reflect on and validate the lives, motives, and efforts of people who took the road less traveled and chose daily happiness over the challenge of the rat race. I am still not sure which of those paths would have been the right one for me. My comments about my lack of courage were directed at me and pointed out the fact that I was not able to choose the path they chose because of my own fears of being permanently outside the competitive track. I needed the validation of promotion and money to feel successful. My comments meant that those things ... promotion and money ... which I did get ... were not fulfilling to me.

As far as anyone feeling that they have a "job just to pay the bills" ... that is their privilege. I re-read those kinds of posts and I did not see any that were feeling sorry for themselves for having made that decision. Most of them felt it was their life and were happy they chose that instead of competing in the rat race like I did. Some postings did gripe about knowing more than younger more formally educated bosses, but those are not the ones that said "I work to pay the bills". The postings that were griping were generally anti-managment and were of a very different perspective than "I don't want to be in the rat race". You lumped them all together in forming your opinion and should not have.


I can talk about the effect on most people who choose the same route that I chose and now are looking back on their careers. Many of them feel the same way that I do ... they are burned out and are looking forward to getting out. And, if they had the opportunity to do it all over again, many would not.

It will be interesting to see how you feel 25 years down the road. Time has a way of rounding all the edges and providing a broader perspective.

Good luck to you.

[larrym]

Interesting conversation. Don't know that I can add anything but wanted to say this. It seems, if we're not careful, that what we do becomes who we are. Think about it, when you meet someone for the first time among the first information exchanged is name and what you do. Yet nothing could be further from the truth. Who we are, has to do with the kind of husband we are, or the kind of parent, friend or neighbor. I've just retired and at my age seem to be attending more funerals than I like. At those occassions one seldom hears or even thinks about titles or pay, etc. Instead we remember what kind of a friend that person was, how they treated others or the kind of family they produced. It's difficult, but important, to keep focused on whats really important in this life and that's almost never what we do for a living.

[ebijack]

i believe a few points have been missed. (the best time to find a job is when you already have one).....
there are alot of folks who like their jobs but hate the management, or the way the business is run. it might have nothing to do with liking/not liking your job, but hating to go into work because of the crap you have to put up with. (i believe that's the biggest complaint)
if you've never had to find a new job that can pay the bills when you have a family (laid off, bought out, etc), you probably won't fully understand the reprocussions of what it takes to be able to get a job that CAN pay the bills (and cover the ones your mounting while looking)...it comes out of necessity and lots of pressure to "take care of the family". you can only hope it's a job you can tolerate or even remotely like. anyone who loves there job is very lucky, and hopfully it stay's that way for them. but for others, it's a means to an end. "i thought i wanted a career, but turns out i only wanted a pay check". with alot of jobs out there, management can and will force you to not like to be at work. i've had to many jobs where that is a fact.
i'll get off my soapbox now....

[SnellTier]

ebijack,

I think you hit the nail right on the head. Been there, done that. It is obvious you have been around the block.

Tomd

[targa2]

Hey,I'm a carpenter and I have a $50,000 (Canadian) boat.Mind you that's only $7.95 U.S.

[SnellTier]

Interesting how perspectives change as we age, huh, Larry? Too many funerals, so little time left to enjoy our friends.

tomd

[Guest Also]

Hey I can't resist adding to this post, and also will do so w/o using my normal handle. I too just turned 55, but not retiring. Selling my own business, where I am making good money, own boss, lots of vacations, and like benefits. Will be taking a political appointment, no job security (serve "at the pleasure") with less pay and less vacation. I'm wondering if I am stupid or what? But the new job needs a better person, I will have the ability to make a difference in things that will affect lots of people, get to have some input into national policy stuff, and they tell me it will be really fun. (But "they" are the government, and the check is in the mail!)
I thought a lot before making this move, or whether I should just coast, and do a lot more fishing. But I decided these opportunities don't come around too often, nor the ability to make a difference. The wife is behind this, even though I will be gone from home much more often. At 55, I think I am too young to be mostly thinking of how can I get more time off to go fishing.
From this post, and the other, where I posted my currrent "real" job, tells me this board truly has a variety of people on it, and most seem to enjoy their jobs, or what they "do". While we might dream of fishing every day, is that really true?? My German mother always said "work is the part of life that makes everything else more sweet" (loosely translated)
I'm glad you are happy to quit, and hope it stays that way. I also hope I am making the right choice!!!!

[JMC]

Websters:
Work----b : the labor, task, or
duty that is one's accustomed means of
livelihood
Job---a (1) : something that has to be done

Yes labor of love is more poetic but I'm a meat & potatoes guy.
I do agree, small talk is a means to get to know someone, but not when you are using it to be judgmental.
I do not believe One's vocation can be used to identify a person because of the perceptions placed on different jobs (we perceive a banker to be upstanding & intelligent, or a trash collector to be uneducated & somewhat sloppy) these are exaggerated. I find the best conversation I have with others have nothing to do about work or what they "do for a living"
Talking about a type of work can be interesting if individuals bragging are left out. I have enjoyed time with a banker & a trash collector equally together because work was left out of the conversation.

Just take a look at Enron; those hardworking aggressive upper management types, whom are probable the biggest con men in America now.

[SnellTier]

Interesting move!!! I hope it works out for you and that you enjoy it.

tomd

[CharlieB]

When I was young my total goal in life was to get ahead and make allot of money and be a Manager. I think it was instilled in me from my dad. I can honestly tell you that those two things do not make you happy in life. For me the things that bring me happiness today is my Faith, Family and last my job. Everybody that works in this country helps to make our economy better. If you have a job and can support your family or yourself you should be very proud at whatever you do. We are all equal no matter what we do and all important in the big picture. God Bless

[Jess]

anonymous,
Thank you for your post. I got out of the service ... Semper Fi .. 4 years ago. After these 4 years I still have no idea what to do with my life as far as a carreer. I got out full of ideas about leadership, teamwork, pride, integrity.etc. I came out of the corp going 100 mph! only to find everything is in reverse. I need to be part of a team. everyone looking in the same direction, Together! I want to be proud of and trust that team. The only place I have been able to find that team has been in old pictures of my high school football team and of Marines I had the honor of serving with. The only true happyness I have is my true love for fishing, hunting, and adventure accept that only occurs on rare days off from this individualist institution ..and alone. It seems the me in those pictures is the only me I know and he doesn't fit in here. I'm 28 years old and adrift.
I was hoping to learn from your experience as it seems you've been in my shoes and I'm heading down a road you've already traveled.
Do you have any advice for me?
Thank you,
Jess

[anonymous]

Hello Jess,

Semper Fi.

I have thought many years about the very issues that you bring up. My recon team was one of the closest knit groups I have ever been with. They were some of the most unselfish individuals that I have known in my life. We had a bond that one simply does not find in our opportunistic individualistic corporate society.

I struggled with those issues and my values throughout my entire career. I felt, like you feel, that I did not fit in. I finally realized that I had to separate my life values from my job values to be able to survive and compete. I literally had to put on a temporary personality every morning when I went to work ... one that was trying to be a team player but was dealing with people who did not operate that way. It was a tremendous strain and not a healthy thing.

If I had it to do over again, I would look outside corporate America, Jess. I feel what you are looking for does not exist inside it.

I would recommend looking into some of the more team-oriented non-private sector jobs. Some things I considered (but by then I was too old to pass the physicals) were police work, EMT work, teaching with coaching of student sports teams on the side, executive "security" corporations, Secret Service, BATF, INS, etc. I have also wondered if one might find some of the same kinds of things in high risk construction work ... like "iron workers" etc. where due to working at heights, etc., people have to work like a team because their safety depends on it. I don't know if this last idea is valid or not.

My heart goes out to you. You are getting to your perspectives about 5 years sooner in your life than I did. (Maybe you are smarter than me.) It would appear you have a better chance of making a change than I did. I hope you do, and I hope I have helped you.

If I can help some more, please let me know. Good luck, my friend.

[Jess]

If you ever need a fishing report or partner on the Western Basin of Lake Erie drop me a line.
Thank you,
Jess

[EyeJacker]

I'll buy that! :)
Jack

[EyeJacker]

Hey man,
It takes some intestinal fortitude to expose one's under belly. The benefits are often two fold though, valuable to those who read it and therapeutic to the author. Trust that was the case here! Thanks for sharing.
Jack

[EyeJacker]

I also have been fortunate to know that type of real friends. This is an excerp from an earlier post of mine in which I attempted to describe that type of true loyal bonding. I posted under a different "handle" several months back. I hope it catures at least a part of that, now ever so illusive, "Esprit de Corps"
"I used to ride my Harley alot when I was younger. I rode with a group of guys that I knew I could count on. Never a question, never a doubt! They would go to the wall for you and on the rare ocassion of having done so would maybe only then ask what it was all about! They never sat in judgement or second guessed you. That was loyalty. Money or job wasn't an issue, nor were there bosses to satisfy or psuedo celebrities with thin skins to appease. The feel of the wind in your face, the open road, the camaraderie, was the bonding agent. Sadly, the day came when I saw the merit in spending that time in my boat, a decision Father Time played a heavy hand in. Still miss the rumble and the roar of my Harley, thundering down the road, more than words can describe. Can still hear and feel it ocassionally on a quiet night. Still miss the kind of loyalty that many may never know! My friends were the kind you find with increasing rarity today,a vanishing breed".

Jack

[EyeJacker]

Jess,
Life can be difficult at times, but it is not static, rather ever evolving. In my job career,I have been a janitor(cleaning toilets among other things), an administrator in a large electronics firm, and the proprietor of an accounting practice with 13 employees. The job that I got the most satisfaction from was that of a councelor for a group home for 4 mentally challenged adults.It brought into sharp focus how truely insignificant my problems were.Happiness resides in the mind,it's a by-product of focusing on the positive, rather than the negative.You will find your niche, be patient and take time to smell the roses along the way! Never give up your values and above all else "to thine ownself be true"
Jack

[pa walleye]

yes I'm a coalman at a power plant in north dakota. not many years left to go. worked costruction most of my life. got me a good retirement job and just coasting. But I do enjoy fishing the p.w.t. meeting a lot of good people.

[risor39]

I don't know what posts you've been reading but most just don't seem to care what you or anyone else does.Just like to fish what else is there?Sounds like you have been a manager for too long.I for one would rather fish with the time I have on this earth and not waste it going to scool again.All I need is family,water and fish.Shut up and fish.

[SnellTier]

Risor ... well spoken!

[Guest User]

Hey, you are all workin'. Get a life and go fishin'. Forget about whether you are or are not a manager. I never yet saw a walleye could give a rip about what a guy does for a livin'. When you are all dead and buried, no one, really, will care about what you did for a livin' or how much money you made. If you made a difference in a kid's life, it just might matter later when this person in turn is makin' a difference in the next kids life. Both the "real life" and "not a manager" have gone on long enuff. Put new line on your spools. Lube your reels. Do somethin' other than this stuff.

[Jess]

Thanks for the advice. I'll never let go of my values. Glad someone can relate.
Well the season is almost here!! I live on the Western Basin of Lake Erie if anyone ever needs a report or partner.
Good luck,
Jess

[risor39]

No we are not unhappy you just think we are.Sorry to burst your bubble but I'm satisfied for the time being paying the bills and a little extra.I still want to be a prof. fisherman.But you can't have everything where would you put it.

[Couldn't agree more]

You're right about most people not caring, I certainly don't. I just get tired of hearing whining. If someone is too embarassed to tell what he does for a living then there are some self-esteem issues running too deep to be cured on this board. Fishing,family,friends, thats what its all about. As far as the management thing, I've been out of it for about 15 years and will never go back. The headaches just aren't worth the money.