2 stroke vs 4 stroke

[buzzyb]

hi guys. i own an outfitting business in Ontario and am looking at replacing my Yamaha 9.9 2 stroke motors [25]. these motors get alot of use, so i need to know what would be better the 2 or 4 stroke. we live in the bush so i do most of the maintanence. we are 3.5 hrs away from town. do you think the smaller 2 stroke motors would ever be outlawed i dont want to end up with 25 expensive boat anchors. would there be much differance in fuel economy?
thanks alot
Buzzyb

[Jimmy Jig]

Who makes a 9.9 hp 2-stroke motor today??

[Pooch]

As a user of camp boats from several camps, I would hate to go back to a two cycle. The only good thing about them was that they smoked and kept the bugs at bay. (Tongue in cheek) And were easy to maintain.

Both camps we stay at have Honda 15hp four strokes and those are the sweetest, user friendly motors I've ever used. Both camps have had the same motors for going on five or six years and they still run like new.
They just never seem to fail or need much attention. We can run and troll all day on a three gallon fuel tank. The only times we need more fuel in the evening is if we have made that ten mile run to a necked down area of the lake and trolled all day. Then we occasionally top off the tank before fishing into the evening.

The newer four strokes are pretty impressive and I'm surprised that any camps would consider two stroke motors anymore. Price? Ease of maintenance? I don't know.

Good luck with your choice. What camp?

Pooch

[boat nut]

Who makes a 9.9 hp 2-stroke motor today??

It appears that Yamaha is the only company making those today.

[buzzyb]

what about general maintanence, oil change every 100 hrs i would be changing oil and filter about every 2 weeks , x 25 motors gets expensive. oil filter is about $15.00 plus 1 quart oil $5.00 = $500.00 every 2 weeks. i only spend $500.00 a year for 2-cycle oil. these prices are aproximate but i think you get the idea.
thanks

[Pooch]

Good point buzzyb. Surely the newer two cycles arern't as "dirty" as the old ones I've been accustomed to. I'd be curious what you decide. I think that the remote cabins I've stayed with kept the two strokes for maintenance reasons also. Pain in the butt to have to drop a group off then PM the camp boats.

Pooch

[Burr]

I didn't think any outfitters purchased their motors any more. I thought everyone leased them.

I would anticipate you'll know better than anyone, and have more riding on it. If you can't find your answers prior to purchase, buy half of each and let us know as the years go by.

IMO, I'd make my bed with the 4 strokes. Even if you exceeded the oil change interval.

[perchjerker]

if you are buying filters by the case I would bet you can get them a lot less then $15 a pop

My 4 stk Yam 9.9 doesnt even take a filter

[Jimmy Jig]

If I run a motor every day in the North country I sure wouldn't be changing the oil and filter every two weeks or 100 hrs. Where's the dirt to come from? I change my motors oil every year, but thats only about 80 hrs. and its not too costly.

[stinkycat]

Just a thought.... I have never stayed at a resort and used a camp boat. I have always stayed where we could bring our own boat but.... I am sure that if I was looking to stay and utilized a camp boat, I would not stay at a resort that had 2 strokes. If I am going that far I want to make sure I have no problems with the boat & motor. Now maybe the newer 2 strokes are very dependable but with all the info out the last 5-10 years on 4 strokes my peace of mind would come from a 4 stroke. IMO

[SteveJ]

I am sure that if I was looking to stay and utilized a camp boat, I would not stay at a resort that had 2 strokes. If I am going that far I want to make sure I have no problems with the boat & motor. Now maybe the newer 2 strokes are very dependable but with all the info out the last 5-10 years on 4 strokes my peace of mind would come from a 4 stroke. IMO

Are you suggesting that there was a reliability problem with the lower horsepower 2-stroke outboards? Yeah they can smoke a little, but that's not a reliability concern. My father still uses a 40+ year old Johnson 9 1/2 hp motor. It hasn't been in the shop yet. I certainly wouldn't base my decision on where to stay based on their use of 15hp 2-strokes versus 15 hp 4-stroke motors. Things like the quality of the fishing, the quality of the facilities and the service they provide would be far more important to me. The condition of their equipment, 2-stroke or 4-stroke, would be far more important to me.

[stinkycat]

Are you suggesting that there was a reliability problem with the lower horsepower 2-stroke outboards? Yeah they can smoke a little, but that's not a reliability concern. My father still uses a 40+ year old Johnson 9 1/2 hp motor. It hasn't been in the shop yet. I certainly wouldn't base my decision on where to stay based on their use of 15hp 2-strokes versus 15 hp 4-stroke motors. Things like the quality of the fishing, the quality of the facilities and the service they provide would be far more important to me. The condition of their equipment, 2-stroke or 4-stroke, would be far more important to me.

Yes, to poorly maintained 2 strokes. Just looking at a little history makes me feel better with newer tech of the 4 strokes. Over all but not every situation.... 4 strokes in the smaller hp are more reliable, quieter, better on fuel, less smoke. Plus if I was going to use a camp boat... I absolutely want the motor to not only run every time I turn the key or pull the rope, but I want it quiet and smoke free. Part of the package of where you are staying is the boat and motor. Fishing quality, facilities and service are nothing if the boat sucks! I go on these trips to fish and if the number one item ie... the boat/motor... is not up to par, well thats a big strike against the resort and does not matter how nice everything else is. IMHO.

[Drummer Boy]

I to do not under stand that last statement I have both and have Ben in camps that have had both.You can have problems with any of them.If he is a good outfiter he will have good equipment weather its four or two stroke.One other thing if they fly or take the motor to other lakes it is a pain to haul four strokes unless they are upright or the oil is drained .I would think having a few two strokes in camp would be the way to go if he transports fisherman this way no mater what he decides for the rest of his fleet.

[KP]

I have a REALLY hard time believing you put 100 hours on each one of your motors every two weeks. That means each motor is running an average of 7 hours every day. Does anyone fish at your resort or just drive the boats around all day? I think you are WAY over estimating the effort you need to put into maintaining the motors. I could see you starting the season with fresh oil and changing it once during the summer. The filter can be replaced every other oil change.

[fww2]

I would run the 2 strokes. Easier to maintain. 2 stroke carbed Yammi's do not smoke that bad with good oil, plus they are cheaper.

[buzzyb]

it is very easy to put 100 hrs every 2 weeks. our cabins are anywhere from 3 miles to 18 mile away from our main lodge. alot of our fisherman troll from daybrake to nightfall.
buzzyb

[Pooch]

I'll back you up on the 100 hours every two weeks thing buzzyb! We troll more or less all day with few exceptions and I know the boats we use are getting more than 50 hours a week on them. That is one reason we like the four strokes.

I wouldn't let a camp that had only two strokes be a deal breaker for me though. If we wanted to fish a particular lake we would go, unless the boats and motors looked like crap.

Pooch

[whofan]

I would change the oil for sure after the first 100 hours to remove the metal particals from the breakin period.
I would then consult my dealer or manufacture about seasonal oil changes.
I`d be willing to bet you could extend out the service intervals a bit cosidering these motors are used a lot and condensation in the oil wouldn`t be a big factor.

I have use a Honda 15hp before and its a great motor. The guy who owns it abuses it, and it holds up well.
I think as of right now the four stroke is the only choice in the small outboard size?
Of course you have to go with a good local dealer reguardless of make. All names in the business are good motors.

I have heard that Bombardier is going to come out with a Evinrude Etec in the small outboard, to replace the discontiued Johnson line????????

If you have a NAPA or simuliar auto parts store in your area, you may be able to cross reference your oil filter number to one of the big names like Wix. You could save some $$$$ by doing this.

These things you can check out and maybe the four stroke would be a more economical choice over that of a two stroke.

[GBS]

The Manitoba lodge we went to last summer was pondering exactly the same question. While not yet having converted, they were anticipating doing so this year. Same issues - long, long drive to town, 50 hr weeks on the motors, etc. Do a web search for "Grass River Lodge" near Flin Flon. Owners winter in Oklahoma. Give Ike the owner a call - heck of a great guy - and a real serious airplance mechanic - he races Mustanges at Reno in the off season! If anyone knows both how to treat an engine AND how to do it most economically, he would. He's been not only worried about guest convienience with his boat motors, he has to be top notch to keep his aircraft fleet safe for guests.