My buddy sold our boat part 2

[Just curious]

A good question came up on this post. What is the proper ediquette for people who do not own a boat but fish with someone who does? I myself have told my friends that I fish because I like to. But what they do understand is when they want to go to Lake Ontario to fish it cost alot of money. Cabin rental, gas for the truck round trip, food, launch fee, boat gas, etc... I live by Giant Stadium in New Jersey. It is a 4 hr. ride to our fishing spot, usually $ 80.00 in gas round trip. Cabin rental is minimum of $60.00 per night for 2. Gas for boat is now cheap because of my 9.9 4 stroke for trolling. Ramp fee is $6.00 per day, boat storage is $ 10.00 per week up there. Food is ?? per day. Over the last 5 years it went from 1 weekend a year to 10 weekends, 3 weekends for trout and 7 weekends for walleye. The guys who fish for trout also fish walleyes a month later. This years cabin rate for the time I will be fishing is $ 2200.00 including boat storage. I will buy the year pass for the ramp for $ 75.00 this year. What it has come down to now is that it is way to expensive for me to TREAT my friends to a weekend of great lakes walleye fishing. My question is- is it wrong to have them pay for lodging, split gas usually 3 ways, buy their own food and help with the storage and ramp expenses? I put 500+ miles a weekend on my truck for 10 weekends, use my fully rigged boat, all my equipment, just to see smiles on my friends faces when they hook a 8 lb. walleye. Would they ever go if I did not own a boat, no, most would not hire a guide. Do they ask to go year after year, yes. Do I enjoy all the different people I take fishing with me, yes, most are not good fisherman and some only fish 1 time a year( the guys from work ). It seems to me that they think of a weekend on the big pond as an adventure that they do 1 time a year. I on the other hand would go for the 7 weekends of walleye fishing even if they did not go but I would not be in a cabin, I would sleep in my truck to keep the expense down. Then I fish back at home. I am not a guide and I don't make a penny doing this, everbody pays their way for the weekend. I just love to fish. Is what I am doing wrong? Do other people do this also to help curtail expenses on long weekend trips? One thing for sure is that when the walleyes are there so will I. Still looking for my 1st 10+ lb. fish! My friends have taken 10+ with me but there never on the end of my lure. Sorry this is so long but I need to know if what I am doing is wrong.

[LakeRat]

If you have no friends fishing with you, will you still go alone all the time? If the answer is yes, charge them a fee sufficient to cover some expenses. If the answer is no, don't charge them a thing. Just stop going!

They really should ask if they can pay for something to offset your costs. Your being taken for granted or just plain used.

[SUPERTROLLER]

What you are actually doing is taking several vacations every year. It should be expected then that everyone pays an equal amount to cover all costs involved. The other posting referred to weekend fisherman/friends and I assumed that they were fishing locally. If we leave town it is 100% split equally for gas, food, lodging. We take turns driving on trips and even just going to the ramp on weekends locally. This evens out mileage on tow vehicles. There's not a lot to daily expenses if we stay local. Usually only use a couple gallons of gas and we've both got yearly stickers for the boat ramp. A couple dozen crawlers and we're all set to go.

[Pooch]

There is a fine line between freindship and being taken advantage of. Most people want to pay thier fair share. A few don't. Weed out the guys that may not be carrying thier share of the load. Be honest with them about expenses. I would not ask them to share expenses that you would have anyway. (boat storage, ramp fees, etc.) But they need to share the other expenses (boat and truck fuel, bait and anything else that contributes to the expense of the group) and even help you with some of yours by picking up the tab for your lunch or share of the cabin.

Anytime someone else is hosting a trip and your the guest, show your appreciation by carring MORE than your share of the load.

Just my nickels worth.

Pooch

[bluelund]

Curious,

I could have written your post almost word for word. Only difference is I fish Lake of the Woods in Minnesota instead of Lake Ontario. I agree there is a fine line between being a nice guy and being taken advantage of. Unfortunately the ones that take advantage the worst never seem to realize it. There is no easy solution to your situation unless you can teach your dog how to net fish, then you will always have a loyal fishing companion.(lol) I usually pull up to the gas dock and fill the boat after we are done fishing as a group, if the guys don't chip in for gas at that time, I usually don't invite them back. I may have to fish alone sometimes, but the peace of mind is worth it. The guys that are true friends always find a way to get even with you, but you might find out you only have a couple of true friends and the rest are just along for the ride. Just my .02 worth.

Take care and good fishing,

Bob M

[Hawgeye]

It seems that you have the money pretty well itemized therefore know how much the trip is going to cost well in advance. That being said, there is nothing wrong with telling your buddies that it will cost approximately X amount of dollars and they are welcome to go. If they know how much it will cost up front, and still want to go, you know they are still friends that you want to fish with. If they back out, then they were free loaders that were taking advantage of you.

I invite people with me on short trips and don't expect anything from them. Almost every single time, they will fill my tank, buy me lunch, bait, whatever without me saying a word except thank you. Those people know the costs in wear and tear even if I would have gone anyway. If I go on a long trip (over 2 hours away and over night) I will invite them the following way. "Would you like to join me at Lake X this weekend? It will cost each one of us about x amount of dollars. I would enjoy your company if you are interested".

[MAGNA19]

when we go to lake ontario on weekend trips,it is an unritten rule(law) that everything,including lost tackle is split between all parties there.we get a campsite at selkirk shores,$17 a night,food there in town,gas,oil,launches are free when staying in a state park campsite,and anything else involved in the trip.any maintence done before we go we all chip in and do.the boat driving detail is split with everyone in the boat,so no one feels left out.we split everything.

hoping the fishing gets better on the lake this year!

[IaCraig]

What I do on most long trips is, use my pickup to tow, use my fully rigged boat and find 2 or sometimes 3 guys who want to go with me and split all expenses encountered during the trip equally. I do not expect any reimbursment for dinged props or wear & tear on equipment though. I truely would have gone with or without them, so if something breaks it would have broken if they were there or not. Besides I have a darn nice rig that is well maintained, so if we take mine I know the chances of mechanical failures are low and if we do not find fish it is not the electronics fault. I am lucky, I have taken 4 different guys on my trips and they are all great fun and share in the work. (I have not cleaned a fish in ??? trips)


I have no complaints.

[REW]

The general rule that we have, is that the person who drives, does not buy truck gas. The person who has the boat - does not buy boat gas. The purchase price, and other upkeep - is that persons responsibility. It is only fair, that the other folks fishing at the behest of the tow vehicle or in the boat - owned by another person - should pay for the gas.

We have done this for years, and I think that all of us feel that that is a fair way to work the expenses. If they didn't they wouldn't continue to fish together.

It works for us.

The important thing -- make it clear up front - that that is the way the trip expenses are going to work. Obviously if someone is in a hardship position, and you want to gift them the expenses, that is fine - otherwise, everyone knows up front about what the expenses will be -- because everyone shares and shares alike - everyone takes a bit more care of everything on the trip.

If no one - has any monitery liability on the trip - there is sometimes a bit of a careless attitude about other folks equipment.

Take care
REW

[BD]

We go on a houseboating trip to LOTW every year. The expenses are shared equally for the houseboat, motel, gas etc with one exception. The driver is responsible for the vehicle being in good condition and gets no help if there is a breakdown. The driver also gets a fifty dollars per rider credit ($150 with three riders per vehicle) to go toward wear and tear on the vehicle. If a tire needs to be replaced due to a road hazard it is payed for by the group. If the engine goes because the owner doesn't know how to change oil, he better have a good credit card.

I would let the guys know well in advance that I would not be able to take them along anymore unless they agree to split the cost of the motel, gas, and bait. Some of them will probably feel a little guilty and offer to compensate you for the trips you have taken in the past. Those who don't might find an excuse not to go anymore.

"Fishing reduces the ego in Presidents and former Presidents, for at fishing most men are not equal to boys." --- Herbert Hoover

[Fish_on]

I went to a remote area of Canada with a group of guys for several years, even a couple times in some years. We always appointed a banker, then everyone chipped in a $50 to get the bank started. The banker was responsible for paying for gas, bait, groceries, pop, etc. Anything that was used by the group. When the bank got low, everyone chipped in another $20. This included the guys who had boats and campers on the truck (like me) and the guys who just showed up with nothing but a couple rods and a tackle box. Most guys who didn't supply boats, campers, vehicles or camping equipment would offer a little something, or pay for my breakfast at a restaurant, whatever. I'm sure that me and the other guy who has a boat and camper (we usually took two trucks with campers and boats for 6-8 guys) didn't care that we came out a little on the short end most times. Matter of fact, when some of our boys got old enough to come, and they had several friends who wanted to come along, we made a policy that any boy who wanted to go could come for a flat $50 but it had to be their own $50. Then my buddy with the other rig would offer them farmwork to earn the $50. It was a good policy and as far as I know it was completely free from hard feelings. I was fortunate that these were a great bunch of guys. We did this for about 15 trips or more from '85 to '97. People in the group came and went and a couple of them are still going on their own even though we've all drifted apart. Talking about it makes me miss it!

[tahoej]

I tore my acl in July of last year! Was on Lake Erie trolling for some Monster eyes in 6-8 footers! We were going west and waves coming NorEast. Got broad sided by a 12-15ft Rouge wave and knocked me off the helm. You ask why im telling you this, well i had to sell my 30ft Sporty cause couldnt take care of it. My buddy has a 28ft Mako, that is docked up in Catawba. We split all fees 50/50. I alawys buy bait breakfast beer and the local Hookers! All routine maintanance we split. Thats the best way to do it i think. Remember if you dont have a boat dont disrespect you buddy with the boat or he will be waving to you while your on the shore!

[Gut Hook]

It's interesting how these threads can go so many directions. With the attitude I've seen from a few here it's surprising they don't find themselves with no-one to "hi-five" after a big fish hits the net.

I think some may have missed my original question: Can anybody recommend a Canoe/Trailer/Outboard combination. I am fully prepared to make to purchase.

Up until now both by fishing partner (not just a secondary aquaintance) and my brother have been the ones with fishing boats. I have never "free-loaded" nor do I intend to. I replaced two trailer tires in the middle of Ontario for my brother's rig. I pitch in every time something comes up on the road. The statement about "just buying the bait" was sort of a joke. Tongue-in-cheek. You know?

So I get back to my original post: Is there a good canoe package out there?

Thanks,
G.H.

[Smitty]

I think there is a difference between a 1 day fishing outing at a local lake and a "fishing trip".. If I take someone along for a day to the local lake, I expect absolutely nothing in return. I'm taking them because I enjoy their company, but would have gone and incurred the same expense anyway.
When we go to Minnesota or our yearly Lake Erie trip everyone kicks into the "kitty" and all expenses are paid from there except for personal stuff (smokes, beer, etc). I (or any of the other boat owners) am still responsible for my equipment (truck, boat, etc) and any maintenance or breakdowns that may occur. I bought the boat to fish and the truck to pull the boat, so I don't expect others to maintain either. This method has been working fine for as long as I have been going on fishing trips (20 years). It used to be someone elses truck/boat, now it's mine. It all comes out in the wash.
Others are right. In "trip" situations make sure costs are settled up front and everyone will be much happier.

[Just Curious]

Thanks for the thoughts. Each one of these persons has been paying their way for the last 5 years. They are all friends and wish they could all go together at the same time but we would need a huge boat which would not be resonable. The cost of the cabin is paid well in advance of the trips to ensure we have a place to stay. I fully enjoy taking said persons fishing and I have never had a problem with them mistreating my equipment. To gut hooked, I was just curious to find out what is right and wrong. I mean you no harm. I wish I had a canoe for you, or knew where to get one. As far as people loosing my lures, if they loose one, I don't want them to pay the outragous price for it up there so I tell them to get coffee and donuts and we are even. They are more than happy to pay for a replacement. Expecially if it is the hot lure of the weekend. I to, do not expect them to pay for repairs on boat or truck, thats my responsibility. Well it is almost time to fish and I am ready, so are all my fishing partners, they are calling on a daily basis to see if they can go already. Thanks

[tahoej]

Buy a 14ft Lund with 25hp 4 stroke!

[freeloaders 'R' us]

i guess that the line has been crossed from friend to freeloader with me. count your blessings if you have fishing partners who chip in for costs without asking. rew i agree with your thoughts as i have done that when i was the one tagging along with others. if i were wealthy i would not care or if my friend was strapped for cash i would understand that but neither are the case. add to that the self invitations and the bragging about promotions at work and it just gets to me and the relaxation and fun are lost.

[The Great Guide]

Over the last 20 years I've traveled all over with many different guys on many different trips. I absolutly have no expectation of anyone helping to pay $$$ to maintain anything I own. I buy the boats, trucks, campers, etc, for me and not them. It's me that extends the invitation and depending on where we go and for how long what expenses I think is fair for them to help out with. Mostly, lodging, gas, and bait all of which I usually split. Of the 50 or so different faces that have been along on my many trips most of them couldn't do more to help out with trip expenses. There are two notable experiences that I have had one positive and one negative, at least in my opinion.

First the negative....We had been fishing LOW for five days. There were three of us sharing my boat. The resort offered a discount of $50 per person for using our own boat. When we were checking out the resort owner automatically applied the discount to my share of the bill. This one guy raised a big objection saying he ought to get the $50. $50 bucks isn't going to make me rich or poor so in the intrest of peace I told the owner to add the $50 to my bill. I still think of that guy as a cheapskate.

The positive was when I had returned from a week trip to Lac Suel. The next day, a guy who was a friend but had never been on a trip with me before showed up at my house with a gift certifcate for an oil change and a inside and out wash for my truck. He also had a gallon of Yam Lube and wouldn't leave until the boat shined. He didn't have to do anything like that, but I had a really nice feeling that he would be that considerate.

TGG

[freegolf&fish2]

curious, i had a buddy along fishing on lake michigan a couple years ago and we were forced to stay on shore one day due to high winds on the lake side of door county area. the green bay side was fairly good weather and we decided to golf on that side instead of fish that day. the course was great. high hills and we were tucked out of the wind for most of the day. golfing was fun, paying his green fees and mine wasn't fun. not only did i get stiffed on green fees, but the fuel and oil for the vehicle and boat didn't get handled fairly either. i paid too much. he paid too little. guess what, he has not been back since and i have caught many, many nice fish with some other great guys that know how to pay their way! leave the chumps at home and take the friends that can pay their way and be fair with all of the expenses.

[sib]

I have a canoe by Leisure life Ltd, not a square stern, but a regular canoe. I like the canoe and it's design. It has some cool features inside like, underseat cooler(great for bait or beverage), watertight storage compartment, beverage holders and 3 seats. Here is what their square stern looks like, same inside as mine.

http://www.llboats.com/WQ154.html

Holds up to a 4hp it says, but never have used the square stern. I throw mine on top of my Taurus and you may want to research looking at a Thule cartop carrier as another option. Of course, then you'd have to attach the power at every launch. I'm sure you can find a trailer for a canoe, just don't know of any.

[TP180]

After multiple trips to Erie and Canada with different groups, here is what I found works best. Before you leave, start two money pools; one for gas and one for everything else. The person with the truck and boat (funny how it usually ends up being the same person) does not pay into the gas pool, and the truck and boat are topped off when we get home. The other pool is used to pay for bait, hotels, cabins, etc. Any money left over is split at the end. No question about whether everyone pays their fair share or not and if someone does not like the arrangement, they can back out before you leave. I have been on both ends of deal, the person with the truck and the boat, and the person invited to go along. I think it is fair.