Spring walleye tourney ethical?

[bigfish1965]

So a thought came over me the other day while reading about an April walleye tourney. The locale and timing of this tourney would place it directly in the middle of the walleye spawn and late pre-spawn. I wonder why no one has found this to be a problem. While many of the great lakes have year round season for walleye, shouldn't we as knowledgable fisherman do our part and not disturb the spawning process? Isn't it in our own best interests to do EVERYTHING to help ensure a successful spawn? I would think that the many 8-10 pounders caught during such a tourney would be the most prolific spawners. Has our cabin fever from a long winter and the prizes awaiting the winner taken over our common sense? I live near a local river in which the walleye are now heading up to spawn. It is open season on them, but I will not fish for them in there now, and will not divulge their location to anyone this time of year. Maybe I'm becoming too much of a tree hugger.ACK!

[CAPITALIST]

HEY TREEHUGGER, DON'T PUSH YOUR FISH MORALITY ON US!!!!!!!! And stay up in canada were all you socialist commi's live. Capitalism for all

[Bad Finger]

Bigfish,

Not too many walleye were taken to the scales. All Sauger. The tourney is run with the support of the Illinois DNR. They took every fish caught and trucked them to the hatchery. There, they srtip the fish of eggs and milt and restock the river better than mother nature ever could. Catch rates have gone up 10 fold since the MWC came to town.

Do a little more digging. It's and interesting story.

[John]

Hey capatalist your a real H*Mo

[pepe]

Hey big fish i totally agree with you. but we seem to be a minority. I think that big fish was refering to the rcl tourney in the detroit river and the pwt tourney on lake erie. You would think that all these walleye pros that enter these tournaments would set a better example...

[highhorse]

dudes, if the spring tournaments will have any negative affect on a fishery; the permit will not be granted or the permit will minimize the amount of fish allowed at the scales. step down off the high horses and relax. the RCL live release was nearly 90%. this is a small price to pay for good, clean entertainment. just think, all of us sportsman continue to judge each others choices and decisions and the tree huggers just inch a little closer to further limiting our choices. get a clue and release the fish you want and quit picking at the guys that enjoy spending their time competing in these catch and release tournaments. if the fisheries (lakes) could not support the minimal amount of mortality, the fisheries departments would not grant the permits. i love the choices we can make in this great country. i am sure some of you could find a socialist government somewhere that will limit many of your choices. do us all a favor and go look for that place and move there.

[High Roller]

Not when there is money involved.

[SUPERTROLLER]

Since almost all tournaments are release tournaments I don't have a problem with them being run at any time of the year. If the waters are already open season to the general public, a tournament would actually take less fish out of the system than a normal weekend of fishing there would. Even with pre-fishing days and some mortality, there is less impact from tournaments. The day-to-day general sportfishermen will impact a fishery far more over the course of the year than the tournament anglers. As long as it's within the laws of the State or Province you're fishing in, IT'S ETHICAL. If it harmed the system in question, they'd change it.

[Mike]

At Marinette WI. at the mouth of the Menomonie River, Marinette Marine has a permit from the DNR and postings by the DNR have been placed at area boat landings announcing use of explosives to assist in dredging the channel. Dredging starts April 1 and is expected to last up to 16 WEEKS!

Now, why is it that a Walleye fisherman can only take 1 fish between March 1 and May 15 and they can dynamite the #### out of it?

Apparently spawning isn't a big deal this year!

[bigfish1965]

Actually, pepe was right in my reference to the Det River tourney. I am glad to see that responsible move from the tourney you were in Badfinger. However, for the other tourneys, the question remains the same. Even with a release program, fish kept in a livewell for more than 20 minutes have a greater than 50% mortality rate. Fish in a livewell for more than an hour, over 75%. Even the ones that survive have probably been over-stressed and most female fish in high stress will prematurely release their eggs. For something that only benefits a select few, perhaps the risk is too high. And in response to Capitalist, there's a reason we have the best natural resources on the planet...we try to think ahead to tomorrow.

[Mikey]

And we in the US do not think ahead? You sound nationalist.

[bigfish1965]

No Mikey, I am sorry it sounded that way, I was speaking directly to 'Capitalist' and was not making any broad statement.

[Mikey]

I'm glad, because I remember going hunting in Ontario and of course there is a restriction on uncased guns in vehicles and hunting from vehicles, the common sight was shotgun barrels sticking out of windows of vehicles with Ontario license plates. And it was nearly every other vehicle. I was shocked at the disreguard for their own resources.

[szopster]

Bigfish,I'm with you 100%, spawn time tournaments have ruined many of our southern bass reservoirs for everyone. We should take note of this before it is too late for some of our rivers.

Capitalist, use some of your money on a new set of manners.

[Walleye Express]

Bigfish.
I think the older one gets the tighter he hugs those tree. But lets examine your question. I to thought disturbing spawning fish during their spawn might hurt or traumatize them into not spawning at all. That was until I helped our DNR tag and take datum last spring on the Tittabawassee River. First we used a jet boat with 2 DC current drop booms that stiffined and shocked the walleye into near unconsciousness. They were then netted, dumped and held in a tub on the boat until we could off-load them into a holding pen near the tagging and data area. They were in this tub pretty long and with what I thought were to many other walleye to have adequate oxygen. They were all measured and tagged from the pen, and this process seemed kinda rough. Then the large bulging females, along with the dripping ripe males were squeezed pretty hard to mix that years planting brood in a 6 gallon pail. Both were then uncermoniously tossed back into the river from a high bank. None were tenderly nursed back into shape or held in a water pen to see if they would die from this ordeal. When I asked about this procedure, I was told that they would be just fine. I'm assuming that after 100 years or so of doing this. The DNR knows what it's talking about. So, would hooking, catching, holding and releasing walleye during this time kill them? Probably not to many. Plus, we have to be careful on what rules and laws we want and how we police ourselves. Ever catch a nice smallmouth or another specie out of season? No problem, nice fight, throw it back. What if it was again'st the law to even catch an out of season fish? Think about it, Capt: Dan. P.S. I saw my first 15 pound walleye while helping the DNR out last spring. Man, it looked like a carp with a walleyes head on it.

[Quote your sources]

Big Fish,

Please don't just throw around statistics (which are often very misleading -- e.g. 100% of my children are under two years old...I only have one child etc.) without stating a source. I would like to know what your source is for your statements of mortality.

My understanding is that in most systems fisheries biologists have determined that fishing during the spawn is of little consequence to the walleye population. Check the journals on the research that the MN DNR and WI DNR used to decide to leave the Mississippi River open year round.

While I was in college getting a degree in Fisheries it was made pretty clear that under most circumstances closed seasons were more a tradition (gotta go fishing on the "opener") than biological in nature. There are many examples of fisheries that are open year round, often with the greatest fishing pressure occuring during the spawning period, that are in excellent shape.

As for the Detroit River, I highly doubt that the 572 fish that were weighed in are even a fraction of the fish that are harvested (intentionally) on most days when the bite is on -- heck it seems like there are usually 572 boats fishing the Trenton channel when the fish come in.

Now, there are certain systems where the fish become extremely congregated and particularly easy to take advantage of (e.g. Seagull river coming into Lake Saganaga in Northern MN) and in most of those cases it really becomes a "fair chase" issue (after looking at the tournament results I doubt those anglers would say its too easy for the walleyes -- hardly ever is). In most of those cases the governing fisheries agency usually does good job of protecting those situations.

As for fishing during the spawn one thought for all. Lets take two 5 lb female walleyes through a year of their life starting at spawn time. Both walleyes have a successful spawn and leave the spawning grounds to head for early summer haunts. In August one of those walleyes is caught and harvested by a hungry angler. The other one manages to avoid all lures and makes it to the next spring where it is caught one day before it is to spawn. Question which of the two walleyes contributed more to the production of the fishery?

Food for thought

[ddr]

i agree %100. but what i believe is more unethical than disturbing the spawners, is the almost universally accepted abusive technique that most self proclaimed catch and release fishermen use when releasing fish. i have NEVER seen another fisherman attempt to revive a played out fish before he lets it swim away. just chuck it over the side and high five your buddy. another mistake that seems to be standard practice is, unless it is incidental to picking the fish up or out of the net, no one seems to make sure that they do not handle a fish with dry hands. barbless hooks? no way! as far as not touching a fish anywhere near the gills, it seems that no one would be able to pick up a fish otherwise! all the self righteous cpr fisherman that do not do everything possible to assure that any fish that is to be released is done so as quickly and as gently as possible are nothing more than wanton wasters as far as i am concerned.

[Walleye Express]

ddr.
This may explain some peoples mentality to you. When I was a youngster, my dad bought me a BB gun. I became a very very good shot with this gun. Nothing that flew, swam, crawled or moved was safe from my adolesent stupidity. The carnage, greed and the false sense of manhood was explicitly related to just how many animals I could harvest, posses and show off to my like minded buddies. This mentality grows out of some people with age, and thank God it did with me. I now find it to be my job to teach the young and the old who still need this fix, the difference between being a man and proving your a man. You want to earn my contempt? Tell me about those 90 walleye fillets you have in your freezer. Capt: Dan.

[Wonton Waster]

Reading the article in InFisherman about closed seasons and the scientific research concluding fisheries are not harmed by open season during the spawn has changed my opinion. I don't think tourneys at that time are a threat or bad example. I used to think open season during spawn was terrible.

And DDR, do you wear a surgical mask and bring a veternarian and a walleye EKG with you on the boat to help ensure you have indeed done EVERYTHING to ensure life after capture? If not, do you consider yourself a "wonton waster?" I release about 90% of what I catch (the other 10% are eaten - YIKES). I hold 'em by the tail until they swim away. Other than that, I guess I'm a wonton waster.

[ddr]

tasty buggers ain't they! EKG? no. forceps yes! vet? no. proper technique yes!


http://www.state.ak.us/adfg/sportf/geninfo/selhar/c&r.htmrelease

[bob oh]

You mean planning ahead like gill netting walleyes and smallmouth bass on Lake Erie??? Great planning!!!!!!!!

[tj1n]

Seems to me that theres alot of speculations and opinions. I can only refer to the In-fisherman article from March 2002 issue, it states there is very little increased impact/pressure put on the reproduction due to harvest or C&R during the prespawn. As someone else stated what's the difference whether you catch the fish in Aug., Sept., Oct., etc... vs. catching that very same fish any time during spawn. also only so many fingerlings in the system are gonna survive.

I am all for protecting our resource as are many of you, and used to think that fishing during this period was hard on our systems...but I believe the new research and studies prove that this isn't the actual case and therefore I have no problem with these early tournaments. I do still tend to agree that those of you that think you need to fill your freezers during this opportune fishing period should be used as an anchor.

Travis J.

[Scott Richardson]

Some states ban fishing during the spawn for nesting fish like bass in particular. Studies underway in Illinois, which does not ban fishing during spawn, show removing a male bass from the bed even for short periods can allow predation to take an immense toll on spawning success.

But, walleyes and saugers are broadcast spawners. Released back into the water, they will find a school to mate. Even in healthy fisheries where walleyes are harvested during the spawn, the impact is neglible. I trust the DNR to act in fisheries too fragile to handle the pressure.

On the Illinois River, the MWC catch provides eggs and sperm to fetilize many thousands of sauger that are released back into the river along with the adults. The sauger also provide parentage for the state's saugeye. The saugeye record was broken twice from a 900 acre reservoir just north of here...now 9 pounds, 10 ounces or so.

Good food for thought.

Scott Richardson

[SUPERTROLLER]

I was thinking the same thing! Where did he dream up these statistics? At this time of year, with the cooler water recirculating in the livewell's, the release rates and percentages ought to be as good as it is ever going to get. In the middle of the summer heat we don't have walleye mortality's as bad as he quoted! They're still kicking on the table when we go to fillet'em! And this is after they've been in the livewell for up to 18 hrs. I want to know where his information comes from.

[curt quesnell]

Touch em all Scott Richardson. Good post.

Some Walleye fisherpeople enjoy fretting about Walleyes more than catching them it seems.


Curt Quesnell

[tshot]

The spring tourney is being conducted legally under DNR approval. What would tourney fisherman be doing if not fishing in the tourney, bowling, playing ball.? NO, they would be walleye fishing and they would be keeping fish.
Tourney fish are released, most, successfully.
Tournament anglers care deeply about the fishery. They are constantly coming up with new techniques and products that are passed on to the average guy out on the water to eventually use. We are always willing to share our knowledge with others and promote ethical aspects of fishing.
Just pick up any fishing rag and you will see guys baring their souls with every trick in the book so every one can have a good time on the water. Just my 2 cents

tshot

[bigfish1965]

Good posts everyone. I had hoped to get some people thinking and it looks like many did. I am sure a tourney has little if any impact on the overall fishery of Lake's such as Erie et al. In responce to one query, my stats were as I remembered them from my research at Sir Sanford Fleming College of Natural Resources when I was a youngun. We were trying to emulate not holding fish befor release but what they go through in a livewell for certain lenghts of time.( Rough waves etc.) The fish were released into holding pens ( admittedly we did this test on a variety of fish, not just walleye.) Even though most fish swam immediately after release, many perished later from a build-up of lactic acid in their system.

[TRinMT]

I'd like to invite everyone out to Ft. Peck for the annual Tough-Man Tourney on April 27th. After a long winter, it will be great to meet old friends again.

The last thing we worry about is putting a dent in the local walleye population. Last year only 6 or 7 boats out of 65 caught a fish. This is normal for this tourney. That is how the event got it's name. The temp. can be in the 80's, as last year, or it will snow as in a normal year. Any fish caught are released at a weigh-boat near where they are landed. All fish are measured for length & released.

The night before the tourney, the local Walleyes Unlimited chapter in Jordan, MT. has it's annual fund raising banquet.

I can't think of a better way to start out the new fishing season!

TRinMT

[DUDE]

AMEN BROTHER, I think thats what the capitalist was trying to say....

[capitalist]

Its to bad you dont get to enjoy all the wonders of canada cause of all restrictions that you socialists have. like I said before leave your socialism in canada, we dont want it here in Gods country.

[DUDE]

bigfish and ddr, when you canadians get your gill nets out of the water of lake erie then maybe you can say something. Those nets kill more fish in one month then 150 pro anglers will in a life time. And I bet they take a ton of 8 to 15 pounders.

[since]

since you are holier than thou, can you also walk on water?

[justathought]

spring tourneys would be worse if they used spears. Of course, we now all know spearing in the spring doesn't hurt the resource, that is why only some people can do it. So now we turn to the impact of tourney fishers. Excuse me, I know I am confused. Not.

[SUPERTROLLER]

What part of the Catch and Release Tournament theory are you confusing with a spear? You just want to start bashing the Indians and confuse the issue with tournament anglers.