Wire line trolling

[kaj]

Great Lakes Trollers: I have a Penn 309M which I am considering using for wire line trolling. This outfit will be used for lake trout and maybe muskies. Your input as to the kind of wire, appropriate pound test, reel backing and terminal knots would be much appreciated. Also, will a downrigger rod with a roller tip do the trick or is an all roller rod necessary?
Thanks
Ken

[KevinA]

Lots of options & differing experience on this one.

First the classic 16-20oz bottom bouncing lead weight laker setup: A Penn 309 will work fine. Use around 1000 feet of 27# test 7-8 strand braided stainless wire line. It been 2-3 years since I last set up my reels...I'm pretty sure it was the 27# test stuff...you won't pay much of a price on line thickness and you'll get appreciably less tangles with the heavier line. Why 1000 feet? 1) you'll have alot of line out & big lakers will take a heck of a lot more of it out 2) more importantly, if you get a tangle you'll have to cut off all the line. The one kink you leave in the line will break off. With a thousand feet on the reel you'll have plenty to allow for losing line from a tangle now & then. If you put only 600 feet on a reel & you get a tangle or two you'll have too little on the reel. You'll have to toss out 300-500 feet of good line for no real reason. Opinions vary on the 1000 foot/reel. As for the rod, opinions vary again. I use Kodiak glass rods, full roller rod with Aftco hardened rollers. They are indestructable. I think Eagle Claw & Diawa? have full roller rods out there for 60-80 bucks. Others on this board say they use wire line with a standard ceramic guide rod. They say it works fine. I've never tried this, but I find it alittle hard to believe(for lakers & kings at least), but if it works then it works... In any case you'll need a heavier rod than a DR rod. Bouncing that much lead takes a beefier setup. The rod should be a glass type that is very limber. For terminal tackle I use a wire thimble attached to a very strong snap swivel...this is attached with wire line crimps, put shrink wrap over the crimps to get rid of sharp edges. From the snap swivel on you can use dodgers & flys, squids, spin & glows, spoons.....

Alternative setup: Use a superline, say in 30-50# test. Cabela's Ripcord or Fireline, maybe the new Whiplash...they are all MicroDyneema. Use Palomar knots. Use a beefy, but very limber glass rod with regular ceramic guides. Use any reel that will handle the 16-20oz setup + a 20-30 pound laker + trolling at 1-1.5mph. Some say you'll need around 20% extra line out to reach the same depth as a wireline...I don't think it's that drastic, maybe 10% when it's deep.

Another, even better application of a rig like this is trolling for suspended kings...awesome setup for this. I use them for this more than anything else.

If you run wireline, make sure you have a wire cutters handy. If you snag up and get into a bad situation, cut the line.

[kaj]

Kevin: Thanks for the information, you answered many of my questions. The Kodiak rods you mention, where can they be found? Also, what would be the best length? Once again, thanks for your reply.
Ken

[KevinA]

Kodiak...they're around 8 foot rods. I've seen other people that use them, but have never seen the rods in any sporting goods store. I've also searched the web for them & didn't locate anything. You might call some of the charters on southern shore of Lake Michigan/Wisconsin. There's plenty of them that chase lakers with wire line setups. Here's a few other places you can check/ask:
http://www.great-lakes.org/(see fishing report page)
http://www.glangler.com/threads/index.html
http://www.fishmeister.com/board/

[Fin Addict]

Excellent post! I have used wire line w/ large diving planers for barracuda and king mackeral but have not used as you describe for lakers and salmon. What advantage would this rig hold over simply running a downrigger for fish near the bottom? Or #1 dipsey for suspended fish. Do you hold the rig to maintain constant bottom contact? I would imagine that would get brutal in a hurry. Are you running standard weights or dog whistles so the weight drops off? Thanks!

[KevinA]

I left a few things out on actually running the rods. In the Central Southern & Southern portion of Lake Michigan the bottom is mud or clay...very soft & forgiving of bouncing things along on it without hanging up. The std lake rig uses the 16-20oz teardrop weights or round balls to bounce the bottom. You just let enough wire out to "thump" the bottom every couple seconds. The rod will get into a rhythm....thump....thump.....thump.....it'll lay down & zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz 15 minutes and a sore arm later you'll have a whale boatside. By all means use a very sturdy rod holder (rigger board) to hold the rod. Holding it by hand will give you some pretty sore arms in about 5 minutes. I don't use drop weights. It probably would be more fun without a one pound ball on the line, but leaving lead balls all over the place bothers me a bit, even though lead is inert, won't dissolve in water.......

A Laker rod setup like this will outfish a downrigger setup when fishing for lakers. It's dark 100 feet down...the thumping must help the fish locate the bait.

For suspended fish, some folks say the wire line vibration(?) will get you more strikes than a dipsy or a downrigger. For depth you can count the number of reel passes it takes to bump bottom in 40 feet of water...in 50 feet...in 60 feet.....or use one of those fish finder depth units that track depth & temp in 5 foot increments. I use this method. I then set up a 'dive curve' of feet down vs. number of passes on the reel. One of these setups run around the thermocline with a 0 chrome or white dodger & a green Howie Fly can be brutal on Kings. Like anything else there are days when this rig is hot like nothing else, other days it's average. Fighting a good sized King on wire is a real wrestling match. No line stretch here.

[Fin Addict]

Thanks! I'll haul my wire line rigs out next time I go to Lake Michigan and give it a whirl. I do most of my laker fishing on Superior and my gut tells me too many bottom bounces w/ 16 oz weight and I would be minus a rig but on Michigan should work well. I prefer softer "stand up" tackle for wire lining w/ heavy weights or larger planers. These are shorter fairly stout rods and the shorter length makes them easier to work with when a lot of force is applied on the other end. Just need to be sure to back off on the drag as much as possible as the rod is not so forgiving.