Refund on Canadian Sales tax

[Fritz]

Somebody told me I could apply for a refund of the Ontario Sales tax for my lodging. Any idea how much it is worth? Wher do you get the forms?

Thanks,

Fritz

[Wall-nut]

Ask your host to prepare an invoice upon your departure which itemizes expenses specific to lodging (expenses other than lodging may apply, I'm unclear on the specifics) and, when you get to the border, go to a duty-free store. They'll process your forms and you'll be able to retrieve your GST in Canadian or American funds. From what I can gather, this is a Federal (National?) surcharge and is available regardless in which Province you stayed.

[Greentree]

You can get a refund of Federal GST but not the Provincial PST part of your taxes. The GST refund is 1/2 of the amount spent on specific parts of your bill; or 1/2 of all your expences if they were a package plan. If you provide your host a 20% down payment at least 14 days prior to your stay, the host can credit the refund amount right at departure time with a credit to your bill; we do it all the time with or guests and it saves much time and hassle at the border.

[john]

>Somebody told me I could apply
>for a refund of the
>Ontario Sales tax for my
>lodging. Any idea how
>much it is worth?
>Wher do you get the
>forms?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Fritz


http://www.ccra-adrc.gc.ca/tax/nonresidents/visitors/tax-e.html

there are forms too

[Mr.Misty]

Yeah, you wouldn't want to put any money into the Canadian economy, now would you? We Canadians will foot the bill upkeeping the roads that get you there and the fisheries you fish in...so don't worry about it. Just load up the U-HAUL, stay and an American owned resort on Canadian soil, take several limits of fish and then go home without giving anything back.

If the moderator of this forum erases this message, they are a coward for not letting some real issues be discussed. This is a big problem for Canadians.

M.M.

[LK]

Misty?? I believe you left out a small part about the $1000's of US dollars that we spend while we are up there,in a weeks time, but I am sure that was just an over-site on your part, eh? Guess it would be better if all of us low life Americans just stayed and fished and spent out money in Minnisota, Wisconsin, Michigan and the Dakota's. It's not like the Canadian resorts up there really needed our business anyway!

[Mr.Misty]

You leave thousands of Dollars in Canada? Where? Sprinkled over the forest floor? Ha!

Listen, Americans as individuals are great folk. The problem lies in the NUMBERS. As usual, too many of you are overrunning the outdoors. I have not been to ONE LAKE this year (some remote) without seeing a large American presence. Often they outnumber Canadians 10 to one. Don't believe me? Then you're in denial. I went to one small lake last month that had so many Americans 'residing' there that I couldn't even get enough room to turn my trailer around and launch my boat. No, there's no problem.

Where do you leave your money again?

M.M.

[cisco]

The tax refund is, obviously, a result of Canada's own legislative action. If it is so offensive to Canadians, the simple solution would be to repeal the legislation. I have filed the refund forms and received the refund each time I have stayed in Canada. I also use the duty free stores to purchase items (presumably from Canadians) to bring home for kids and grandkids and my wife. The duty free stores are also Canadian creations.

If U.S. citizens follow Canadian law, it seems strange they should be chewed out for doing so.

[Canuck]

I have no problem with americans coming to my country for a fishing trip or for that matter getting a refund. But please buy your groceries/bait/beer here and quit whining about Border crossings. You are coming to this country for great fishing and the added 50% on the dollar. Us candians are getting dumped on on this board all the time. Well if we are no good then stay home and off our lakes. We dont need the almighty greenback from a select few ignorant people. And misty is right if you take the refund dont complain about the condition of the roads.

[Fritz]

Mr Misty,

For the record,I stay at Clark's Camp. Wayne and Karla are life long Canadian residents. I be surprised if their employees are not Canadians.

If you have a problem with the refund, please encourage your government to change it. I will come anyway.

Fritz

[acp]

Canuk:

The "50%" on the dollar may apply to in places such as grocery stores and gas stations but, all fishing camps that I'm aware of in NW Ontario charge in US$.

Mr.Misty:

My take on the GST rebate is that "your" goverenment has put this legislation into affect as a "carrot" to intice "Ugly Americans" to come spend out money. As others have said, if the legislation is not appreciated, talk to your representatives, don't yell at us Yankees, we're just nibbling on the carrot.

We buy Canadian fising licenses. Don't the camp owners pay Canadian taxes on the money they earn from us Americans? Doesn't this tax revenue help to maintain the Canadian infrastructue?

"You leave thousands of Dollars in Canada? Where? Sprinkled over the forest floor? Ha!" GET REAL!!!


Later....

Al

[Frank from TBay]

I just got back from a resort in the Armstrong area and as a Canadian I was greatly outnumbered. We were the only Canadian party. 12 American parties. The camp owner was a Canadian from Alberta. He is retired and this is his warm weather job. I enjoy meeting and talking with our southern neighbours. They are no different than any other person. There are great guys and there are goofs......just like anywhere on this planet.
I would like to see some feedback from the feds on why they give this tax back. In there wisdom there has to be an answer. Most of the Americans I met were very quick to point out when they figured me as a local to say......"We pratice catch and release and only keep a few small one for the table" These boys can fish in my boat anytime.

[Greentree]

I'm an ex -American camp owner that has everything I ever owned and had invested in Canada; and the camp my wife and I have built and developed. As for Canadians moaning about the US fishermen, let me give you 43 years of real experience. The locals are the most ignorant game pigs that have ever walked the earth, with no respect for the riches available here in NW Ontario. They fish slected local lakes into oblivion and then cry for more. They leave the biggest messes you can find while the Americans are usually the ones to bring it back to camp for disposal. If you think that American camp owners are bad then I best fire the Canadians working here and not spend the $300,000+ that I put into the local economy each year. If you think that all we do is take money out of this country then you really have confermed the level of stupidity that you come from. The visious bull from local Canadians is the most missdirected crap ever spoken. We are proad to be Canadian emigrants and have helped to build the country as all American origin camp owners; most have contributed more to this country than the local born jack pine savages that do all the complaining and then love the US dollars they rob.If you think Canada has a US fisherman problem, pull your head out and take a look in the mirror. Hope the moderator has the guts to let it be heard form the truth.

[Bill McCue]

Time to clear the air:

GST - Goods & Services Tax legislated to replace a hidden excise tax which was perceived to be unfair and not properly distributed.

Tax applied to all purchases across Canada and is not a sales tax.

The tax amount in Ontario is 7% and all visitors to Canada are able to claim exemption on certain purchases not all.

Lodging qualifies as well as restaurant meals etc.

I for one am happy to welcome my southern brothers to Canada, not only for the money they spend here but for the sharing of a wonderful resource.

My own experiences with the tourism industry have at times been frustrating mainly because of people not taking the time to properly question or reply clearly to issues concerning them. Slamming each other verbaly over issues which are not important bother me. The anonominity that people hide behind seems to bring out the worst behavior of all. Urban legends grow from these exibitions of ignorance, if you don't know ask, if you do know reply clearly.

Nuf said

[perturbed]

A legitimate question was asked on the tax which was answered i believe. Then the flame war starts between US and Canadians. Personally the tourists can be good. Or they can be bad
Same for all of us Candians.
However the people that really think that it is only the Canadians causing problems or vice versa, would you be so kind as to leave your comments below about the leeches.
I have no use for any angler, Canadian, American, or wherever they may come from openly and as was quoted in the other post quite proud of the fact about cicumventing the local regulations.

[THUMPER]

With that attitude Greentree you must not have got too much local business. The fact is that in NW Ontario Americans outnumber local Canadians by a factor of five. 80% of NW Ontario Walleye are harvested by Americans. A lot of locals realize that and not being involved in the tourist industry would obviously upset them especially with the new lower limits. To critisize locals as a whole puts you and Jeff Reed in the same boat. The charges by OMNR against Americans are well documented in our local papers. They far outway the local charges. I do not put much stock in this because in every 1000 or so people there is a bad apple or two. What troubles me sir is that you as a tourist operator with your attitude and ideas. Maybe that is why a lot of locals do not go to resorts in their own backyard.

[james lehmann]

> I'm an ex -American camp
>owner that has everything I
>ever owned and had invested
>in Canada; and the camp
>my wife and I have
>built and developed. As for
>Canadians moaning about the US
>fishermen, let me give you
>43 years of real experience.
>The locals are the most
>ignorant game pigs that have
>ever walked the earth, with
>no respect for the riches
>available here in NW Ontario.
>They fish slected local lakes
>into oblivion and then cry
>for more. They leave the
>biggest messes you can find
>while the Americans are usually
>the ones to bring it
>back to camp for disposal.
>If you think that American
>camp owners are bad then
>I best fire the Canadians
>working here and not spend
>the $300,000 that I put
>into the local economy each
>year. If you think that
>all we do is take
>money out of this country
>then you really have confermed
>the level of stupidity that
>you come from. The visious
>bull from local Canadians is
>the most missdirected crap ever
>spoken. We are proad to
>be Canadian emigrants and have
>helped to build the country
>as all American origin camp
>owners; most have contributed more
>to this country than the
>local born jack pine savages
>that do all the complaining
>and then love the US
>dollars they rob.If you think
>Canada has a US fisherman
>problem, pull your head out
>and take a look in
>the mirror. Hope the moderator
>has the guts to let
>it be heard form the
>truth.

[Jackpine Savage]

Pass me another beer.... eh. This Greentree guy is a real piece of work. He needs to lighten up a bit.

[Jig'N John]

Greentree,

Why don't you crawl back into your hole, you are a real loser!

[Jackpine Savage]

You harvest what you plant Greentree. You are pretty down on us kind law loving gentle Canadians. You mentioned that you built up a resort....camps in our neck of the woods are cottages....so I'll stick with your desrcription. Kindly give us the name of the resort or the lake. You sound like an owner I once met near Upsula. I like that term Jackpine Savage..........never heard it before. I mentioned it to the guys at work and most had a good laugh at your expense. A lot of the red necks in our place who have had some bad experiences with guys like you said " typical American". This I find to be the sad part.

[Hunter]

Hey Greentree
If you dont like "the most ignorant game pigs that ever walked the earth" Why the he** did you build a resort over here. If you dont like my country, the one that is making you rich, then get the he** out. And if you want to start degrading my fellow citizens dont hide behind the name Green Tree, show how brave you are!

Gary Kaminski

[wawajake]

We are obviously well off topic , but as you can see some of us Canadians have a sensitive spot, where we draw the line. Appreciating some factors that causes this sensitivity about American paying taxes here is another one of those factors.
An example being in the Sault to Wawa area of Ontario there 20 or 30 whole townships that are not "crown land" (not government managed) These privately owned townships (thousands and thousand of acres) are owned by an American conglomerate for the logging and other lease profits.
Included in the lease business is 1200 waterfront camp leases on lakes within those townships. At lease 90% of those waterfront one acre leases (and lodges)are held by Americans , that continue to will them or sell them to Americans through out the past 30 or 40 years of history.
It is extremely difficult for a Canadian to get a lease because no new ones are ever issued . It is just as difficult for Canadians to get their own piece of Canadian Wilderness from the Government on crown land because what few come available , the price is escalated by foreign investors willing to pay more because wilderness is gone in their own country.
So yes us locals get testy , we are outnumbered and out bid on our own land . Yet our fishing regulations and access gets tighter and tighter because of the numbers using our resources.
Could we vote in a Government more sympathetic to our needs , actually no , because our rural votes are drowned out by the big city votes from urban areas from Toronto, to Vancouver.
So take it easy on us , yes the money you spend is appreciated especcialy when it is with the odd canadian lodge owner, but much of the money spent at least in my area goes into american bank accounts .
thanks for your appreciation and please take extra care of our resources.

[cisco]

The sooner we can think of resources in a global context, the better off we'll all be. Look at the tension that exists when states that share resources with Ontario have resource management questions. For example, Minnesota and Ontario; Ohio and Ontario; the feds both places -- Great Lakes and St. Lawrence River (US and Canada water).

And, of course, we now have a US President who wants to drill as aggressively as the Canadian owner of the controversial Crandon (Wis) mine project. Lumber and mining interests have really raped the resource on both sides of the border -- with no apparent inclination to slow down.

Some guy simply asked how to get his refund. The refund is offered by Canada, and can be revoked by Canada. I get my refund each time I visit the Provinces, and suggest it is the legal thing to do, under Canadian law.

[duffy]

I will assume that I am like most americans who visit the beautiful unspoiled land of NW ontario. I visit the area because of it's beauty and it's fishing. The last thing I want to do to this area is ruin it by harvesting fish. Every single fish I catch goes back unharmed except for two per day for lunch. Do the math 7 days x 2 fish= 14 fish. When I go I bring my american money and spend it on the lodge, grocercies, hotels, fishing licsenses, and of course beer. I buy all of this in the town of Red Lake at local shops. They love my american money and I am treated very well by most of the poeple there becasue they realize that if they are not in the tourist business then they go in the mines. I think the canadians that have responded negatively to this post should realize that my money has paid for some kid in Red Lake to get new shoes or a new winter coat. This alone does not give me the right to think I'm great or I can do anything i want to the land in that area. If i respect the land and treat it properly then I should get the respect of the local people becasue I am a customer how feeds their families. Although green tree does go a bit over board he does make one point. I go on a fly in north of Red lake. On the lakes we fish there is usually a single native cabin that gets used once or twice a year. You should see what these people do. All garbage from aluminmum cans to dirty diapers are just thrown all over the place. It makes me sick to see this. So much for the old american Indian commercial with the Indian on the side of the road crying while standing in garbage!!! When we are done cooking we bag all garbage and bring it back to camp for proper disposal. I think most american guests do this becasue we appreciate the beauty of the place and want to keep coming back to enjoy it for ever becasue it is so hard to find in the U.S. So, the candians who are standing of the soap box about protecting the area, don't preach to us, educate your own. Just my tow cents.

Duffy

[Lk]

I think for every Canadian example you can give an American example. I have heard Ontario DNR say they have more problems with locals than Americans but then I have watched(in discust) as some Americans loaded up their RV with EVERYTHING that they caught. So it happens from both sides of the border so its not the citizenship of the person but the education of the person. I have just read an article the the US & Canada may "Open UP" the border in the next few years because of NAFTA and the border patrol will become almost nill. WE as fishermen MUST police ourselves or all of us will pay the price and it doesn't matter what side of the border you live on. Just respect the land and the people that you are visiting !! NOW do I have to go thru ALL of your tackle boxes and take out all the sharp objects!!!??? ANYONE???....Buehler?????

[THUMPER]

Some good points discussed here. People are people and it does not matter race or nationality. Slobs are slobs. We do a lot of business with native organizations and I find them no different than you or I..... A small example of littering....I am in the process of developing some property on a NW Ontario lake and had to use a bar finder over the past week to find a property bar......The garbage that I encountered with the detector was unreal....Lots of cans, old bars, But mostly cans.....hundreds of them some probably 50 years old by the markings...Lots of American beer cans......lots of Canadian beer cans. "Let he who is without blame cast....."

[chrism]

Thumper
Right on - Slobs are slobs regardless of origin!

I personally see no need to badmouth anyone because of where they are from. Why?

I have seen many people from many origins oblivious to the regulations with no concern for limits or slots. The solution is simple - just tell them it isn't tolerated - then post a T.I.P.s poster in the fishhouse. Report them. Remember - think global, think for the future of fishing!

As for the tax refund thing - well, My experience is that having people visit either side of the border is a good thing, and usually the money spent outweighs that small GST refund. Look at the big picture people - I know of many lodges that would turn into trapper's shacks if there were no clients from wherever!

And yes, we Canadians are lucky to have the resources we have. Remember that and respect them or stay home regardless of where you are from.

Do I have a personal beef? Yes - as do most true fisherpeople - let the big fish go!!!!! They are the gene pool for the future!

Chris

[Atlanta Dave]

MR. Misty
I don't think you understands the financial impact we make on our fishing trips to Canada.I don't know of any people from Canada among the 200 or so who go to the camp on Lake Athasasca that we attend each year.I would think the $2500.00 per person is very near and dear to the camp owners. The only fish not released are for the shore lunch and no fish are brought back. This fishing resource should last for eternity as long as the natives and the locals, who can get to it to fish , practice the same catch and release as we do.
I would presume your government has weighed the impact made by tourism and the tax rebate and I am sure the scales are tipped markedly in favor of the tourists. I think that if the government stopped all fishing by Americans in canada that the fishing industry would be almost nonexistent in a year or possibly two.
Misty I think you need to rethink your stance and try not to lump all American fishermen into a group with the few who take an extra fish home.

[Steve]

Sorry to such a bother down here! I guess we all should all just stay home. I did not know that I was not wanted in your country. I just wanted to come up with my family have a good time not bother anyone or cause any trouble. Yes I would have to spend some money. But I don't want my family to be bad mouthed. I sure don't want my sons to start off on the wrong foot with any young Canadian people and act like us grown ups. Just wanted to say Sorry!! at home.