Performance limits at 14’-16’; entry-level advice

[Aerocraft67]

I’m researching my first boat purchase, upgrading from a 35-year-old, 14' aluminum utility boat (medium-V) with 4 hp Mercury that my dad gave me. I'll tow with an AWD, 4-cylinder, Subaru Forester with 2,000 lb capacity (although, the same vehicle is rated over 3,000 lb overseas). My primary fishing venue is a nearby 11,000 acre lake in Southern Indiana (walleye, hybrid white/striped bass, crappie, largemouth, catfish), but I’d like to hit other venues, such as northerns up North. I'd also like to take my wife and dog out occasionally.

I’m considering a 14’ aluminum deep-V tiller with 25 hp Yamaha 4-stroke. What are the limits of this rig—both upper and lower? How big of a lake and how rough conditions could you fish in? Can you get into the back of a shallow cove? Given my towing limits, I could go up to 16’6” (less than 1,000 lb. hull weight) with 50 hp. Can you backtroll this effectively without a kicker? How about the coves? Could you fish Lake Erie?

What’s the trade-off between these rigs? Speed-wise, it looks like a five-minute difference in an end-to-end run on my local lake, which isn’t much incentive. I’ll be lucky to hit big water more than twice a year, but the capability might be nice—just not at the expense of stealth and flexibility on local lakes. I just want to fish adeptly (not professionally) in a wide variety of conditions—wind, rain, waves, speedboat wakes, shallow coves, trolling, casting, etc. Getting caught in 25 mph winds last month with my current rig is what accelerated my purchase intentions in the first place, as if immobility weren’t enough.

Beyond that, I seek your all-around suggestions for an entry-level, multi-species boat—including specs and features to consider (beam width, hull design and gauge, storage, carpet vs. vinyl, aluminum vs. wood floor, rod storage, livewell, fuel tank, battery compartment—what matters at the entry level?). I’d even consider a dual console and walk-through windshield on the bigger rig if it didn’t compromise too much fishability. Since people often upgrade from this class of boat, does it make more sense to buy used, and if so, from a private seller? Otherwise, can you recommend a dealer in my area?

Thanks for your advice and for a great board in general.

[Brian_MN]

Aero,

Take a look at the classifieds...I just listed a 1999 16 foot Alumacraft with a 1999 25HP Yamaha 4 stroke that might be just what you're looking for. It's got a vinyl floor, 2 seats, livewell, external 6 gallon gas tank, and a trolling motor. It doesn't have rod lockers, but has holders where you can lay down 4-6 rods and keep them safe and out of the way. It's a nice fishing boat, and can do most anything you'd want to do with a smaller boat.

[BeenThere]

My wife and I fished Lake of the Woods NorthEast quadrant for a week in 1993 with a 16 foot tin camp boat with a 25 hp motor on it. We did not go out on the single windiest day that week but I don't even go out now in my current 18 footer in that kind of weather ... it is just too bouncy to try to fish comfortably. But the 16 footer did just fine for us the rest of the week.

Lots of folks still use them as camp boats up there and they have 25 hp motors on them. I will say that most camps are now "upgrading" to boats with floors etc and are putting 50's on their boats.

If you can afford the 16 and have a storage spot for it, go with it over the 14, in my opinion. Every boat I have had except my current 18 footer "shrunk" when I put it in the water. My wife and I fished out of 14 footers in 1991 and 1992 and the 16 was sure a lot more comfortable and stable. This was noticable even for just the 2 of us. I would think it would be easier to sell a 16 rather than a 14, too, once you want to upgrade.

As far as your question about the 50 ... yes you should be able to troll down with it with no problem. You might find that you want to put an electric trolling motor on it just for convenience. I would think that vertical jigging with the 50 might be a challenge as far as holding the boat in one spot, but to be honest I have never tried it with that large a motor. Once I graduated from the 25's I went to electric trolling motors.

As far as advantages of a 50, the boat will come up on plane faster and will be faster (I usually hear 3 mph faster for every 10 hp added).

Good luck with your choice.

[orchard frank]

Try to find something you are happy with the first time. Trading up in a year or two is usually more costly than getting what you want now. There are always good deals on pretty new used boats because of this happening. Almost everybody is happier with an extra foot or two, it keeps us in the game. Good Luck.

[rebelrn2001]

Your tow vehicle will come into play here with the 'upgraded' boats. A hull weight of under 1000# will net you near the 2000# once you are all done easy. That 2000# includes you and your wife and your dog along with the motor and weight of the trailer and gas and tackle and rods....you get the picture. My experience is the towing capacity of the vehicle is over-rated and you notice very quickly when you get even remotely near that number. Acceleration is greatly depressed, gas milage drops dramatically. Stopping is much more difficult and can become unsafe in an emergency. Good luck in the new boat though. There is nothing like a 'new' rig no matter what size it is.

[Troutbeck]

Aero:

Here's my two cents: I had a 14 footer and just went up to a 18 footer. For your situation, I'd suggest something between the two. The 16 footer would be ideal. With the Subaru, I would not want to get too heavy. I'd recommend not going over 1,000-1,200 lbs. But you should be able to do that and still get a nice setup. I disagree on the 50hp motor. I just don't think you need it if you fish mostly small lakes. Plus you'll pay more for it and it is heavier. Nissan (Tohatsu) and Honda both make lightweight 30hp 4 strokes. You might want to take a look at them. A 25 would also be plenty for most situations. Almost all the manufacturers make them. And in Indiana (I'm a hoosier, too) you can still buy a 2 stroke.

Plus, the 50 will NOT troll down as slow as the smaller motors. I know cuz I have a new 50hp on my Alaskan. I can get down to 2 mph. On a 16 footer it would be even faster. I also have heard the four strokes troll a little faster than the twos.

Anyway, good luck--and have fun!

Trout

[DUDE]

Aero, Im not sure of exactly where your from in the lake erie region, but go to ravenna ohio. Ravenna marine is on the corner of rt 14 and rt 59, the south west corner. We have a 14 foot crestliner boat that is 84 inches wide that would have plenty of room for you and your wife and dog. If you put a 20 hp honda or a 25 hp merc 4-stroke on it, it will meet all your weight requirements and will meet all your needs. I sold 2 of these at the cleveland boat show this past january. And the people love them. Erie safe but you have to pick the right day. With the width of the boat, it is more stable in the water than your tipical 14 footer. Ask for Bill or Mark and make sure you tell them that steve sent you there from walleye central.

[Phil T.]

Ah yes, the days of the 14' cartopper. Most of us started with simple little boats.
Will a 14' boat handle rough water? It depends on how it's loaded. With a single person, and minimal stuff, it will do fine. I lived at Devils Lake for three years and only had a 14' cartopper boat. Lightweight boats bob like corks. When the wind comes up, don't force the issue, let the boat ride over the waves (go slow).
For two people, I'd consider a 16' boat adequate. I am amazed at the waves that kick up on shallow lakes, like Leech in MN, when the wind comes up. There are always pairs of anglers in a 16' utility boats drifting through the surf. They seem to have less trouble than those of us with larger boats with interiors that add weight and decrease bouyancy. Flat floors, consoles, and built-in storage are really nice, but all that plywood and carpet adds weight, and the boat isn't really in the "starter" class.
Weight is a limitation for you. Look at the thinner-skinned, lighter weight models, sometimes called "resort" boats. You won't be pulling water skiers, nor will you be racing other tournament anglers to the hot spot. 3/4 the rated horsepower will be plenty. Reduce the amount of stuff you take with you. Weight, whether in the tow vehicle or the towed boat, counts in the gross combined weight rating. Do your calculations, but actually scale the total package before setting out for any distance.

[MarkG]

14-16 ft of the type which you may end up with is not for big water like Lake Erie. Your Suburu also a limitation as some 16 ft can be deep wide and heavy. If you are looking for a well equipped 14,look at the Lund Rebel-V 1450. Its wide,deep,a true deep-V, lots of storage,livewell,etc .Hull gauge .080 which is thicker than most 14 ft boats. Would be a nice rig with a Yamaha 30 or 35 4 stroke and probably within the weight limits of you tow vehicle. If you had a more substantial tow vehicle,I would recommend the 1650 Rebel-V over the 1450 but its totally rigged tow weight would be beyond it for serious long distance travel. However the standard Rebel 16 which is a thinner gauge more lightweight hull may something to look at. The dry weight on that hull is only about 450#,and still will only require a 30-35hp motor A total package tow weight will be well within your limits. If you do not necessarily want or need all the whistles and bells on your boat,or even a floor ,all the stuff that adds weight,you could actually go to a bigger boat,like an 18 ft rowboat style with benchseats and no floor.May give you more cabability as to what conditions you can fish. Your big limit is your tow vehicle.

[MarkG]

14-16 ft of the type which you may end up with is not for big water like Lake Erie. Your Suburu also a limitation as some 16 ft can be deep wide and heavy. If you are looking for a well equipped 14,look at the Lund Rebel-V 1450. Its wide,deep,a true deep-V, lots of storage,livewell,etc .Hull gauge .080 which is thicker than most 14 ft boats. Would be a nice rig with a Yamaha 30 or 35 4 stroke and probably within the weight limits of you tow vehicle. If you had a more substantial tow vehicle,I would recommend the 1650 Rebel-V over the 1450 but its totally rigged tow weight would be beyond it for serious long distance travel. However the standard Rebel 16 which is a thinner gauge more lightweight hull may something to look at. The dry weight on that hull is only about 450#,and still will only require a 30-35hp motor A total package tow weight will be well within your limits. If you do not necessarily want or need all the whistles and bells on your boat,or even a floor ,all the stuff that adds weight,you could actually go to a bigger boat,like an 18 ft rowboat style with benchseats and no floor.May give you more cabability as to what conditions you can fish. Your big limit is your tow vehicle.

[WA]

I would go with a 16' in the class of a Lund Rebel....Alumacraft Lunker.....G3 167....or the like. Typically these boats will be well under 2000lbs fully rigged. Everyone has a preference on motors, but with a set-up like these you have some flexibility to shop for what matches your pocketbook too. You could reasonable use anything from a 25 to 50hp. I would suggest purchasing a transom troller to use if you are concerned about trolling speed, but again that is a matter of preference.
Good luck and happy fishing!

[WA]

I would go with a 16' in the class of a Lund Rebel....Alumacraft Lunker.....G3 167....or the like. Typically these boats will be well under 2000lbs fully rigged. Everyone has a preference on motors, but with a set-up like these you have some flexibility to shop for what matches your pocketbook too. You could reasonable use anything from a 25 to 50hp. I would suggest purchasing a transom troller to use if you are concerned about trolling speed, but again that is a matter of preference.
Good luck and happy fishing!

[Aerocraft67]

Thanks again for the great advice. Between these replies and lots of archive searching, it sounds like there’s not much to gain by scaling down, so I should maximize the boat specs given my towing constraints. Although, one guy recommended backtrolling with a 14’ Lund and 9.9 motor, and that he’s happy with his rig both here and in Canada.

I’m converging on a 16.5’ tiller (say, Lund Rebel 1650 or Alumacraft Lunker 165) rated for 50 hp and equipped with 40 hp four-stroke and an electric trolling motor or two. I presume this setup will let me run from 0 to 30 mph in acceptably small increments, get into reasonably shallow water, and hold up well in rough inland water. And, if I found a good deal on this class of boat rigged with a 25 hp (which seems common), it would do the job O.K.

The package should weigh less than 75% of my 2,000 lb towing capacity (660 lb hull, 200 lb motor, 350 lb trailer, 200 lbs gear, 90 lbs fuel [12 gal]). Launch should be O.K. with the Forester’s AWD and rear limited slip differential, and hopefully adding a transmission cooler and trailer brakes will enable decent long-distance, non-overdrive hauling a few times per year. Sound right?

But could I squeeze in more boat? The Alumacraft Navigator or Magnum (16.5', 840 lb hull), rated for 60 hp and equipped with a 50 hp motor (250 lb), 20 gal. fuel, 550 lb trailer, and 200 lbs gear would top out just under 2,000 lb. Unfortunately, the Lund 1600 Explorer (940 lb) tips over the limit with these assumptions by about 60 lbs. Do you suppose that these boats were designed with a 2,000 lb towing limit in mind? Are my assumptions sound? Anything else to consider?

With all my obsessing over this, my wife thinks I’m nuts—and she hasn’t even seen the spreadsheets. Thanks again.

[Rapaleye]

I'll throw a slight curve at you but given the rig you last posted, lund rebel with 40 4 stroke, I'll bet this fiberglass one would be competitively priced.
Yarcraft cobra 16 (600 lbs boat only)
Evinrude e-tech 40, 50 or 60 which ever your budget will allow. They are all the same engine weight. Very compact and lighter than your 4 stroke. It is fuel injected so it will perform well in cold weather. Direct injected two stroke will be very quick with great low end thrust and just as fuel efficient.
What ever you decide I would skimp 10 hp on the engine and put great electronics on it including at least a hand held WAAS capable GPS.
I sacrificed 20 hp on my boat and put all that money into electronics and a great bowmount and it is the best money I spent. It may take me 5 more minutes to get to where I am going but I can find my spot with in 10 ft and stay right on top of it with the good electronics and boat control.
Good Luck
Jim

[Justfishing]

towing capacity includes only the driver in the tow vehicle. Passenger and gear in the tow vehicle reduce your towing capacity. You probably need to keep you boat/motor/trailer etc at 1400lbs. This wil give you 600lbs for gear and the wife.