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Old 05-13-2007, 02:50 PM
hgmeyer hgmeyer is offline
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Location: Elgin, IL, USA.
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Default RE: FLW Red Wing

I believe the guy had a somewhat sophisticated plan... His fish were tied to the stumps and limbs with heavy mono... He would cast until he caught the mono and then retrieved the fish... I presume he hooked the line and thereby hooked the fish... This might not have been immediately discernible, if at all, by a Co-angler who was not asked to net a fish and/or was instyructed to just "stay back there"...

Nevertheless, the guy was caught and his wife and kid(s) were present at the weigh-in.

My final comment is that the sentence was far too lenient... If he wasn't going to get jail time... the fine should have been at leadst equal to the first place prize he tried to steal... That just might deter a few... make it a "civil penalty", not dischargeable in a bankruptcy...
"Fear me all ye who dwell beneath the waves"
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Old 05-14-2007, 01:32 AM
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Default RE: FLW Red Wing

Juls this is what you said and is what I was referring to and I didn't put words into your MOUTH. YOU READ WWHAT YOU SAID IN THE FOLLOWING QUOTE:

I agree, BUT, that Co will also need to take a lie detector test, in my opinion too.
That would need to be in place, in order to keep a Co who might of had a bad day with their Pro, from taking it out on their Pro, by falsly accusing them of something that never happened.

It would be sooooo much easier, if everyone were just HONEST and played by the rules. What's so dang hard about that????


Old 05-14-2007, 02:23 AM
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Default RE: FLW Red Wing


Nope. He was NOT DQ'd for cheating because he caught on real quick that the "tail" boat was binocular watching every move he made so his plan to cheat plan was foiled unlike the 2 previous years. I gave explicit and detailed instructions to my "tail" boat to give him plenty of room to fish but never let him out of your sight and write down times and locations every hour. My "tail" boat noted he was fishing erratic and spooky plus he pulled stakes twice only to return to the same area. When he found out that the "TAIL" BOAT was watching and he couldn't "shake" the "tail" boat, he didn't execute his plan. This time he brought in fish that were NOT white and were not DEAD and I silently stood there on the last day while watching and smiling as his fish were weighed. Additionally, he would NOT look at me face to face as I stood there watching. Plus, he did NOT place in the top 10 either. Did he know he was being watched? Absolutely! IF he WASN'T cheating or did NOT have a plan to cheat would you expect him to come to me face to face and get a first person explanation on why he was "tailed" for 2 days? Yup. Did he approach me for an explanation? Nope. Did he whine, complain and generally cry "FOUL" behind my back and claim he was being unfaily chastised? You betcha. Everybody found out what I did and thought it was classy way of keeping a possible cheater from continuing foul habits. Was he cheating in the 2 previous touranments? All I can tell you is by a preponderance of the evidence, the evidence was over whelmingly against him. But, as we all know, the accuser has to prove his allegations. My problem was I had to figure out how he was doing it. Once I figured his cheating method, the rest was easy. Why would I suspect him in the first place you ask? Lets just say a good reliable source told me HOW he cheated in another tournament on his home body of water. Like I said draw your own conclusions. My "tail" boat skipper asked me what would I have done if he would have come to me and cried foul? I told him, if he does come to me and cries foul then I owe him an apology. If he doesn't approach me....I nailed him.
Old 05-14-2007, 04:35 AM
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Juls Juls is offline
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Default RE: FLW Red Wing

Yep, AGAIN...I'm talking about the Co angler NOT the PRO in my post.

Now you're just being silly.

It's going to be a beautiful day...have a good one.


Old 05-14-2007, 05:02 AM
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Default RE: FLW Red Wing

As a Co, I feal that is also my responsibilty to make sure we get back on time. If I do something to make us late than I should be penalized also. When we leave the launch area I make sure that I look at the time. When we get to the fishing hole I look at the time. If it was a real long run I note that I will take up to 50% longer to make it back. Lets say that it took 1-hour to get there. On most days the winds will pick up some and make the ride back longer. Knowing that it will take 1 1/2 hrs to get back I start causually start talking to the Pro at 1:45 mins before weigh-in that we might want to think about going in. Making some comments about keeping the fish alive. Penalities for dead fish, and so on. Sometimes I get you are right and other times I get some S$%$.
Last year on Lake Erie League event we made a long run that took 1 hr to get there. At 2 hrs remaining we had a 36 lbs in the boat. Knowing that that could win I started talking to the pro. I told him that we could not have all 5 fish dead as that would cost us 2 1/2 lbs and we should start in. After been sternly told who was in charge he did agree. By taking our time coming back and stoping every 15 mins to give the fish a little breather we only lost one. Had we lost all 5 (and we would) we would have dropped to 6th. By making my suggestions we finished 3rd.

My point is that the Co is just as responsible to getting back on time. I do not think that any pro would keep his co from cashing a check if he can. Punish the Co just like you do the Pro.
Old 05-14-2007, 09:09 AM
Posts: n/a
Default RE: FLW Red Wing

SILLY you Say?

First of all a polygraph test by a cerified examiner cost 500-700 dollars. Why would a co-angler be subject to a polygraph test and NOT the pro under your rules? Is there something special about the pro where he is excempt from a polygraph test and only the
CO angler is required to take the test? Expensive polygraph tests prove nothing and are NOT allowed in criminal or civil court and only add to the bottom line of the company providing the test.

What you need to experience is the running and total administration of a major high dollar fishing tournament. I suggest you have a good competant attorney to mitigate your mistakes. When you try enforce the rules to prevent cheating, if you do it the WRONG way, You WILL BE SUED in a court of Law and YOU WILL pay damages. That Juls, is how the game is played in 2007.

Most if not all state's fraud statutes will cover a fisherman cheating and recieving prize money under false pretenses. Fraud is a felony in most states too. The civil penalty is covered under breach of contract rules. When you sign a tournament application, you are signing a contact between you and the hosting organization. This agreement contains the 3 basic elements of a contract which are offer, acceptance and consideration.

When a fishermman accepts the application including the rules, he agrees to abide by the rules. The agreement also binds the tournament organization to enforce those rules using legally appropriate methods dictated by the circummstance. Many more tournament organizations breach the contract than fisherman when they mis-apply the rules, DON'T do things according to the rules and fail to inform ALL interested participating parties. If the anglers knew they could get their entry fees refunded by small claims courts by slip-shod rules administration, alot more fishing tournament directors would quit freelancing the rules. Simply stated, the tournament organizers can't do it if it isn't in the rules, if they do change the rules, they have to notify each and every tournament participant in a fair manner which does NOT include notification during the tournament on the water with unreliable VHF and Cellphone communication. Legally speaking, if a fisherman didn't want to agree to a rule change after he was properly notified, on water or not, he could demand and get his entry fee back since the change was NOT in the original application he agreed to.

I wonder how many walleye tournament anglers know about that? Surely not enough? When was the last time you heard of a tournament participant demanding a refund for an ill informed rule change? IF and when I ever again enter a money stakes fishing tournament and the rules are changed in midstream (pun intended), I will demand a refund of the entry fee and am prepared go to court to get my refund. IF a rule/rules were changed different from the original agreement, The tournament organization doesn't have a legal leg to stand on.
Old 05-14-2007, 01:05 PM
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Chad Chad is offline
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Location: Fargo, ND, USA.
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Default RE: FLW Red Wing

Fuzzy....If you go to a team format this will leave a bunch of guys out in the cold. The co anglers!

Some do not own boats. Some are not interested in team events. Some fish to learn from pro's. Some cant afford the team event.

I would guess that the co anglers are more of the intended target market for the advertisers!

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