MWC Downslide

I've been away from the game for a few years, but holy cow, the MWC numbers are way down!!

Is this all from a slow economy or are the events not as big and well promoted as they were when Kaz was doing the PR? I have not been involved since back when they had all the shows televised and the weigh-ins had the big Cabelas bus, big stage, etc. Big crowds at the weigh-ins and Kaz was the MC and Kristine Houtman was the manager there.

How long have they been so down?

Any of the pro tournaments filling fields?

[Burr]

In general, tournaments as a whole started on a serious slide back in 2008. Last year, there appeared to be somewhat on a rebound and building numbers again.

On the national scene - FLW numbers last year specifically were up materially. AIM not so much, but AIM trying some new things in 2012 to see if they can experience the same participation increase.

Mid Level tournaments - like the MWC and NTC tournaments have been pretty creative to try to increase participation - the biggest change from years ago here is there seems to just be less in this category. The FLW league for instance - is no more.

On the local, regional level - there are lots of tournaments that are no longer in existence - some of the more successful regional events are still there - fewer tournaments overall. Some local and regional tournaments that always "filled" quickly - no longer fill - but still draw a respectable field of competitors and numbers. Instead of 125 teams, they may have 80,90, or 60...

I'd like to say something specific about sponsorship - but I think in reality sponsorships have always been a changing and challenging target, and very critical for a tournament to continue. It appears there may be a bit more support now as the economy shows some signs of stability. Still, it's a changing market. There has been a social media marketing change and somewhat of a sense of urgency to find the right position.

But then again, that's just one person's point of view.

Hory Kow, I believe the numbers went down when you stopped fishing them. I know I stopped when I heard you did.

[Chad]

Have the number of teams fishing an MWC event actually diminished? Really? Do you think there are less teams fishing an MWC event today? I was actually surprised what the numbers I found showed.

This year the MWC has 9 events from the great lakes to Colorado.
In the year 2000 they had a total of 4 events.

I looked up the data for the numbers of teams fishing MWC events in 2000 and in 2011.

2000-4 events with total of 746 Teams
(225-SV/196 Big Stone/161BdN/164 Oconto)

2003-4 events
2004-6 events
2006-6+1 exhibition
2009-9 events

2011-9 events with 750 Teams
Central (123-SV/72-RW/136-BdN)=331
East (112-Det/83-Sandusky/63-SSM)=258
West (61-DL/46-Mob/54-CassLk) = 161

The # of anglers at each individual event is down but the # of entries for the whole season has remained level (at least comparing 2000 to 2011). One could draw a conclusion that the MWC is working harder to keep the same number of anglers fishing their circuit. They have decided to go to the Angler. Instead of teams traveling all over for 4 events they can choose ones closer to home.

It's no secret that I am a big proponent of the MWC.

Chad is write, the numbers have not changed to what people think they have. I know one thing, I run TFCTTT for one reason. Thats to give the fishermen another outlet to win money to fish events like the MWC, FLW, AIM. The MWC is by far the most prestige walleye tour in the country. Growing up in the 70's and 80's in Min. All I can say is take a look at all the past MWC champions that have made a diffrents in the world of fishing and you will see the honest truth. Its not all about the big PAY DAY!!!. The MWC about KID'S FAMILY, AND FRIENDS FOR LIFE. Just remember one thing, the individuals who give their time away from family and friends to give you tournament anglers the oppertunity put that wood on the wall and the cash in the bank, are putting in just as much time and effort as you are with no wood on the wall and no money in the back after thier weekend. (Its a job like you work during the week) Next time you think about what is going wrong, THINK ABOUT WHATS GOING RIGHT, THAT YOU EVEN GOT THE OPPERTUNITY TO FISH FOR MONEY!!! We all think we have it bad! I am sure glad I was not around in the dirty 30's when things were realy tough.

Dave Underhill
CEO TFCTTT

PS. I know I cant write very well and Im sure thier is someone who will point this out. All I can say to you, is look in the mear before make your comments.

Thanks for the answers.

I didn't realize the contestants are just spread around and not fewer.

I guess they just seem so small when when compared to Spring Valley having a waiting list with over 220 teams competing and the other events getting over 150 teams.

Interesting decision by the MWC to offer more events all over the place without increasing the number of contestants by much. Seems like it would cost them a lot more to pay for all of the added events, especially since they are not filling any of the tournaments like they did previously. Good for the local anglers who don't care to travel far though.

I sure hope they stay around. It sure was a well run machine with a ton of hoopla back when Cabelas priovided that huge bus as a back drop and the stage was big. That Kristine Houtman sure knew her stuff.

[QUOTE=TFCTTT;1403372]Chad is write, the numbers have not changed to what people think they have. I know one thing, I run TFCTTT for one reason. Thats to give the fishermen another outlet to win money to fish events like the MWC, FLW, AIM. The MWC is by far the most prestige walleye tour in the country. Growing up in the 70's and 80's in Min. All I can say is take a look at all the past MWC champions that have made a diffrents in the world of fishing and you will see the honest truth. Its not all about the big PAY DAY!!!. The MWC about KID'S FAMILY, AND FRIENDS FOR LIFE. Just remember one thing, the individuals who give their time away from family and friends to give you tournament anglers the oppertunity put that wood on the wall and the cash in the bank, are putting in just as much time and effort as you are with no wood on the wall and no money in the back after thier weekend. (Its a job like you work during the week) Next time you think about what is going wrong, THINK ABOUT WHATS GOING RIGHT, THAT YOU EVEN GOT THE OPPERTUNITY TO FISH FOR MONEY!!! We all think we have it bad! I am sure glad I was not around in the dirty 30's when things were realy tough.

Dave Underhill
CEO TFCTTT

PS. I know I cant write very well and Im sure thier is someone who will point this out. All I can say to you, is look in the mear before make your comments.[/QUOTE]

Dave,
Are you telling me that the tournament organizers do not make any money? Who are you kidding! If not for the anglers there would be no tournaments for you to "work" on the weekends. You need anglers to have a tournament; you DO NOT need a tournament to have anglers! The only organizations that have any worth to serious anglers are the ones that payback over 100% of entry fees. The FLW and AIM are the only ones I can thinks of unless it is a standalone event.

[Chad]

[QUOTE=side line observer;1403560]Dave,
Are you telling me that the tournament organizers do not make any money? Who are you kidding! If not for the anglers there would be no tournaments for you to "work" on the weekends. You need anglers to have a tournament; you DO NOT need a tournament to have anglers! The only organizations that have any worth to serious anglers are the ones that payback over 100% of entry fees. The FLW and AIM are the only ones I can thinks of unless it is a standalone event.[/QUOTE]

You are 100% correct that without the anglers there would be no circuits to fish. However, they do need to work together. For there to be a tournament, someone needs to take the risk of promoting and covering the overhead to run the events. I highly doubt the reward is worth the risk. Most do it because they enjoy it, not becuase they plan to rich.

Our club puts on a few tournaments. I know that after payouts, permit fees, printing, advertising, wages, repairs to equipment, there is very little left over. The income (if any) from our club tourneys come from the sponsors-not the anglers. And yes, without the anglers there would be no sponsors!

You may need to add the MWC to your list of paying over 100%. They pay back 80% of the entry at each event with the other 20% going to TOY awards and championship. On top of that there are contingencies, etc...

From MWC press releases "Overall in 2011, the MWC paid back more than 120 percent of entry fees in payouts, team of the year awards and winnings in the no-entry-fee Cabela’s MWC World Walleye Championship."

Chad, I was on the advisory panel and it all comes down to a numbers game. Example, MWC goes to Spring Valley and $15.00 per entered boat goes to the Spring Valley Walleye Club, that is what was paid to them when I was on the board. I'm sure that it has not changed or increased. Is that bad? Probably not for the work they do helping out on the tournament side. That money comes from the entry fee that "we" the anglers pay. The MWC is in this to make money as they are a business plain and simple or why do it? They just don't do it for fun. MWC has employees that they have to pay, so the money has to come from some source, right?

I can really tell you that back in the years we had a waiting list for Spring Valley the payout was sure better! I guess that was also spread out with the fishermen.

It all comes down to one thing, fish it or fish something else if you don't like it. I still like the option of team fishing to split expences but can't afford it with the economy the way it is.

[QUOTE=side line observer;1403560]Dave,
Are you telling me that the tournament organizers do not make any money? Who are you kidding! If not for the anglers there would be no tournaments for you to "work" on the weekends. You need anglers to have a tournament; you DO NOT need a tournament to have anglers! The only organizations that have any worth to serious anglers are the ones that payback over 100% of entry fees. The FLW and AIM are the only ones I can thinks of unless it is a standalone event.[/QUOTE]

Well said! Speaking from experience? The actual cash payouts have made it difficult to support traveling any distance to do most of today's walleye circuits. Talk about percentages all you want, play games with the numbers to make them look good, but in the end if the money isn't there? It isn't there. That and that alone explains the drop in participants the best. IMHO.