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03-16-2021 09:24 AM
C&K
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
I was surprised however that they take dominance over the Wolves as you say. Interesting.
The cats do not allow either coyotes or wolves in their territory. They will run down and kill either on sight. If there is cats around, and the cats find them, the wolves will be driven out. This is an important consideration for hunting wolves because most of the cats are in the North Woods.

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
The incompetence and attitude of the DNR, however is no shocker.
The DNR wardens themselves are decent guys and gals. They're just out there protecting the wildlife from people that would exploit it or break laws. It's the biologists that are stupid beyond all belief. And the money they spend on "managing" and "studying" is basically blown taxpayer dollars - like trying to catch a cat and put a collar on it. Leave the animal alone, let it do what it does and if you want to "study" it then put up some game cams and go interview the locals who see 'em all the time. Go out in the woods and find some deer kills to locate where the cat is hanging out and maybe try to get some photos of it. But don't do stupid stuff like chasing it with dogs to try to put a collar on it. It's not your "property" to track with a radio.

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
If a guy were to draw a tag and go hunt unknown to me land up in your neck of the woods for a Wolf for what would only amount to a 3-4 day hunt if history repeats itself, what's the best tactic to use?
[.........]
And finally, do the locals take kindly to seeing out of staters take part. I know in NE Iowa some get a little protective of "their" Public Hunting Grounds.
I don't know if howling is successful. For calling, if I was going to go wolf hunting, I'd use a small game or deer call instead, like a fawn. Wolves seem to be attracted to anything that's easy food, not to each other. The reason we see so many around during deer hunting and after during the day is because they got gut piles they find to eat.

When it comes to being an out-of-stater, it don't make any difference. The wolves are not what we'd consider a "prized" game animal. Farmers will not turn you away for hunting wolves. Most people around here shot 'em at night with a spotlight. Ran 'em with dogs during the day. Wolves are not exceptionally smart. If you find a pack of 3 or 4 growling and fighting over a deer gut pile, you can shoot one, the rest are so stupid they will mill around yipping and yapping, chamber another round and shoot another one.
03-15-2021 09:12 PM
johnboat I appreciate your stories and perspective.

Yes, I know by big cats you were referring to Mtn Lions/Cougars. The point I was stumbling to make was if my 18 lb fluffy over fed house cat with a bad attitude and a bell on her collar (Mom hated her killing and eating hummingbirds) could slice up the German Shepherd farm dog down the block whenever she felt the need, I can only imagine what the Big'ens you are talking about are capable of. Particularly since they are 10X the size and 20X more powerful. I was surprised however that they take dominance over the Wolves as you say. Interesting.

The incompetence and attitude of the DNR, however is no shocker.
Throw in the fact they were probably assisted with a know-it-all Wildlife Biologist or 2 who have never stepped foot in the area of study, well, that's what you get.

Hypothetical question:
If a guy were to draw a tag and go hunt unknown to me land up in your neck of the woods for a Wolf for what would only amount to a 3-4 day hunt if history repeats itself, what's the best tactic to use?
Howl at night to locate them and go in at first light? Set up and call them in like 'Yotes? Set up a bait site and wait'em out? (I think I read that's ok) I'd prefer not to use dogs.

And finally, do the locals take kindly to seeing out of staters take part. I know in NE Iowa some get a little protective of "their" Public Hunting Grounds.

Thanks for your input.
03-15-2021 04:30 PM
C&K
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
My money is on a good smart cat anyday. As a kid we had a good smart cat who'd stand her ground.
@johnboat A farm cat can be mean enough. But I'm talking about big cats.

When the DNR first saw the photo of the young male cat (about a year and half old) over by Spooner, WI they tried to get some local hunters to chase it so they could put this collar on it. The hunters in the area refused, told the DNR we respect that cat and we're not chasing it with our dogs.

Well, as usual, the DNR does not take "no" for an answer, they got some hired guns to chase it and that did not turn out very well for them. They did manage to tree it once (photo) so they finally believed there is big cats here. But that was the last time they ever saw that one. The cat learned that if it goes up a tree, humans show up and start shooting at it with a dart gun. It leaped 40 feet out of the tree and they never saw it again after 3 days and 30 miles later when they finally lost their dogs and the cat disappeared.

The DNR still thinks there's only one cat in the North Woods because it's the only one they ever seen. But we got news for 'em. The DNR "manages" their deer, bears and wolves with pretty much the same level of competence as they demonstrated trying to catch a little 1 1/2 year old male cat. So those of us that live here have more respect for the cats than we have for the DNR because one of our young male cats proved it is smarter than the DNR.
03-15-2021 12:18 PM
C&K
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
My money is on a good smart cat anyday. As a kid we had a good smart cat who'd stand her ground. The neighborhood dogs eventually learned it was a good idea to stay off Tilly's yard. I can only imagine the beating a non domesticated Big Cat, where size being as it is, would be as you describe.
The cats that live here are well-fed, they have way more food than they do out west. They are typically 200-220 lbs, females a bit smaller around 180 lbs. They live totally on deer and elk (we have some elk up here too). Unlike a wolf pack that can only take an adult deer down in deep snow and primarily goes after fawns in the spring and summer, the cats are very powerful. A single cat can take down a big buck whitetail any time it gets hungry, and it can outrun the deer. So it gets hungry, it just goes out and kills one.

And yes, the cats are beautiful animals. We enjoy seeing them. They are powerful, smart, they know they rule their territory. A single male will roam up to 2,000 sq miles. A 220lb male can disable a 110lb wolf by breaking its back or neck with a single swipe of its paw. Then the cat grabs it by the spine in back of the head and carries it off.

But the cats here don't mess with people, they avoid people, or anything to do with people, like the plague. So while we find their kills sometimes, or sometimes see tracks, actually seeing a cat is very very rare. They have been spotted crossing the road sometimes, but most people don't realize what they saw until it disappears into the brush on the other side of the road and then they realize the tail on that cat was 3 feet long. They are the absolute apex predator of the Wisconsin North Woods.

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
If that's an offer for permission to hunt your property, I accept. I'll pack light and you'll hardly notice I'm there.
If you get a tag, come on up. We got way too many wolves, they have been driven more south in the farm country around US 8 because they got easy pickings with beef cattle. You tell any farmer you're here to hunt wolves, they'll welcome you onto their land and tell you to bring your friends and kill 'em all.
03-12-2021 06:48 PM
johnboat C&K

I enjoyed your reply.

My money is on a good smart cat anyday. As a kid we had a good smart cat who'd stand her ground. The neighborhood dogs eventually learned it was a good idea to stay off Tilly's yard. I can only imagine the beating a non domesticated Big Cat, where size being as it is, would be as you describe.

Here in the cornfields of Iowa there is no where near the opportunity to experience what you see and hear in regards to Wolf activity, so I can completely understand you not "getting" it.

If that's an offer for permission to hunt your property, I accept. I'll pack light and you'll hardly notice I'm there.
🙂. Although it's not just to say I shot one. Other than a thread or two on WC, I keep my hunting experiences to myself, and half a handful of people.
03-12-2021 05:30 PM
C&K
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboat View Post
It's very detailed. I enjoyed the entire read.
That's a very interesting read. But the DNR's ideas with their "scientific" analysis complete with complicated formulas vs reality are two different things. I mean, we spent better than 30 years telling the DNR about the cats here, and they flat denied it. They said there has not been no cats in Wisconsin for 100 years. So we had to show 'em a picture of one and then they said, well there might be one just moving on thru.

Right.

So now that the DNR knows we got cats here, some wildlife biologists show up from Madison with dogs. They're gonna capture the cat and put a radio collar on it. That resulted in a three day chase that concluded with a bunch of dead dogs. This is not Wyoming and the cats here don't tree very easy. The jungle and swamps in the North Woods that a cat can slip thru without even being noticed is not that friendly to a bunch of dogs and humans. Let your dogs off the leash, they'll end up dead chasing a cat. Your telemetry might indicate the cat treed, but a half day later when you get there you're gonna find dead dogs shredded beyond recognition when the cat gets tired of playing with 'em.

Wolves are pretty much the same with the DNR. They have this "perfect" picture. But if they think even for one instant that cattlemen report wolf kills on their beef calves, they are living in a dream world. Those wolves die from lead poisoning, usually 338 Win Mag or 50 BMG variety. If the wolf has a collar on it, which means it was a dumb wolf and got caught, put a round thru that too to make sure the wolf doesn't phone home to the Mother Ship.

So I don't really "get" the big adventure with wolf hunting. Can shoot one out our back door any day of the week with a .22 mag pistol. Running 'em with dogs is just a good excuse to drive around in the pickup and drink Mountain Dew to have good stories at the bar.

If you want to shoot one just to say you got a wolf, come on up. We have no shortage of 'em.
03-12-2021 04:42 PM
C&K
Quote:
Originally Posted by tewwbulltom View Post
What I’m trying to say, is why do you hunt and fish.? If you want to fill your freezer or work hard and use your experience to outwit the beast, but all I hear in Wisconsin is “ wolfs” are eating my deer. They’re missing the boat.
Missing what boat? Wisconsin wolves don't eat much deer except in the winter when they can catch one, or in the spring when fawns are born. They live primarily on beef calves and small game, not deer.

The wolves are not the apex predator here. The big cats are. My wife got a cell phone photo of a cat carrying a dead wolf in its jaws right out our back door. The cats don't eat the wolves, it carries it to what it considers to be the edge of its territory, drops it and scratches some sticks and leaves over it, then takes a piss on it.

The cats don't cause any problem at all. Wolves are a big problem since they'll kill anything that's easy, mostly cattle or fawns, or your pets because they're not afraid of people up here. The cats get along with people just fine. Unless you live here and spend a lot of time outdoors you'll never see one. Wolves, not so much and they'll come right up and sniff around our back yard just to see if there's anything easy to eat. And they won't leave unless we get the 12ga with double awt buck and teach 'em to leave.

We got about as much respect for the wolves as the cats do. They are vermin. Not even coyotes are as stupid and desperate as wolves. The cats will kill coyotes too, but they normally don't because the coyotes are smart enough to keep out of the cat's territory.
03-12-2021 09:07 AM
johnboat
Quote:
Originally Posted by tewwbulltom View Post
I have hunted in the BWCA area for fifty years., crane lake area, the heart of the wolf kingdom. Our group never shot a doe, walked miles to get to our stands, pre 4 wheeler times and lived w the beast. In that period I saw a few and have many stories to tell. Harvesting was not our prime consideration. We hunted and a good week in the woods has its own reward. Pulling the trigger not so much. They are the ultimate predators. Shooting one was very hard, and no one had a good opportunity. Then they started to migrate to Wisconsin and meat hunters didn’t like that, locals in Minnesota had a problem with their dogs being being killed. Etc.etc.
Wolfs have been around forever and should not be exterminated. They are a big part of the environment and there is nothing more chilling than a howl coming close to you.
Now Wisconsin has always had a tradition in group drives and shooting there limits in a day. They still allow baiting, dogs etc. hunting...no harvesting.. why now just let us net fish. It’s effective and it’s easy. That’s not hunting. Native people have a tradition of netting and is judged to be very bad cause “they’re “ netting my fish and I want to catch 100 a day like LOW. I fish Leech and it not that often that you catch your limit. I fish rainbows where a good day on a river is a fish or two caught an three or four break off. A good day on the water for muskies is seeing 3-4.
What I’m trying to say, is why do you hunt and fish.? If you want to fill your freezer or work hard and use your experience to outwit the beast, but all I hear in Wisconsin is “ wolfs” are eating my deer. They’re missing the boat.
Thank you for your post.

To answer your question, I hunt for the challenge.

I've taken 2 Wolves on hunts in Canada. Both were taken with a rifle, me only. No dogs. My next Wolf Hunt will be attempted with my bow. (Border opening assumed)
03-12-2021 08:58 AM
johnboat For those truly interested, Google this:

2020 Wolf Monitoring Report - PDF - Wisconsin DNR.

It's an 18 page report of The Wisconsin Grey Wolf Monitoring Report. 14 April, 2019 - 15 April, 2020.

It's very detailed. I enjoyed the entire read.
03-12-2021 08:41 AM
tewwbulltom
Wolfs

I have hunted in the BWCA area for fifty years., crane lake area, the heart of the wolf kingdom. Our group never shot a doe, walked miles to get to our stands, pre 4 wheeler times and lived w the beast. In that period I saw a few and have many stories to tell. Harvesting was not our prime consideration. We hunted and a good week in the woods has its own reward. Pulling the trigger not so much. They are the ultimate predators. Shooting one was very hard, and no one had a good opportunity. Then they started to migrate to Wisconsin and meat hunters didn’t like that, locals in Minnesota had a problem with their dogs being being killed. Etc.etc.
Wolfs have been around forever and should not be exterminated. They are a big part of the environment and there is nothing more chilling than a howl coming close to you.
Now Wisconsin has always had a tradition in group drives and shooting there limits in a day. They still allow baiting, dogs etc. hunting...no harvesting.. why now just let us net fish. It’s effective and it’s easy. That’s not hunting. Native people have a tradition of netting and is judged to be very bad cause “they’re “ netting my fish and I want to catch 100 a day like LOW. I fish Leech and it not that often that you catch your limit. I fish rainbows where a good day on a river is a fish or two caught an three or four break off. A good day on the water for muskies is seeing 3-4.
What I’m trying to say, is why do you hunt and fish.? If you want to fill your freezer or work hard and use your experience to outwit the beast, but all I hear in Wisconsin is “ wolfs” are eating my deer. They’re missing the boat.
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