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  #21  
Old 01-16-2021, 01:54 PM
jfishpa jfishpa is offline
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Default Not Electric but ;

I don`t think I would want a electric vehicle but this i`m seriously considering.
https://www.motortrend.com/cars/ford...st-first-test/
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  #22  
Old 01-16-2021, 02:54 PM
DW DW is offline
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I will not get an electric vehicle. I object to public policy promoting and mandating electric vehicles. The virtue of electric vehicles as a better “green” alternative is false. However, power companies and various government agencies and units make representations and promotions at taxpayer and ratepayer expense without comprehensive analysis or challenge.
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  #23  
Old 01-16-2021, 03:11 PM
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KPKyllo KPKyllo is offline
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I will not get an electric vehicle. I object to public policy promoting and mandating electric vehicles. The virtue of electric vehicles as a better “green” alternative is false. However, power companies and various government agencies and units make representations and promotions at taxpayer and ratepayer expense without comprehensive analysis or challenge.
Don't stop there. Give us some facts and figures to back up your claims.
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  #24  
Old 01-16-2021, 03:28 PM
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Sportdog Sportdog is offline
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Originally Posted by KPKyllo View Post
Don't stop there. Give us some facts and figures to back up your claims.
Plenty of research out there. Do your own diligence and draw your own conclusions. Don’t be lazy!!!

Myself if I was in the market I would do my own research and decide on my own........
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  #25  
Old 01-17-2021, 12:47 AM
DW DW is offline
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Originally Posted by KPKyllo View Post
Don't stop there. Give us some facts and figures to back up your claims.
If you are an advocate of change the burden and responsibility of justifying change really rests on you. Yet, advocates basically fall back on predetermined talking points rather than facts.

I can respond with many facts and arguments. However for simplicity I condense my argument into a simple statement:

The marginal increase in electric power demand caused each time an electrical vehicle is plugged in is 100 % provided by fossil fuels; more fossil fuels are burnt, and a greater carbon footprint is created by EVs compared to vehicles powered by a conventional combustion engine.

For the advocates of EVs that statement is blasphemy. I request that those who feel that way avoid attacking me, but attempt to articulate a counter argument based on facts.

We are in a process of massive change to EVs costing society trillions of dollars based on talking points resting on a house of cards.
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  #26  
Old 01-17-2021, 06:38 AM
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The marginal increase in electric power demand caused each time an electrical vehicle is plugged in is 100 % provided by fossil fuels; more fossil fuels are burnt, and a greater carbon footprint is created by EVs compared to vehicles powered by a conventional combustion engine.
I'm not trying to attack you but only about 63% of electric power is now produced by fossil fuels in the U.S.. For example, in Iowa, 40% of electrical power is now produced by wind turbines. The percentage of electricity produced by fossil fuels will continue to drop.

I agree that if more fossil fuels have to be burned to supply the electricity for electric cars, the net result doesn't make them environmentally attractive. It's inevitable though that the bulk of electricity in the future will be produced by renewable energy sources, the infrastructure needed for electric vehicles will be put in place, electric vehicle technology will constantly improve and the future of transportation in this country is electric vehicles.
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  #27  
Old 01-17-2021, 06:57 AM
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yarcraft91 yarcraft91 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DW View Post
If you are an advocate of change the burden and responsibility of justifying change really rests on you. Yet, advocates basically fall back on predetermined talking points rather than facts.

I can respond with many facts and arguments. However for simplicity I condense my argument into a simple statement:

The marginal increase in electric power demand caused each time an electrical vehicle is plugged in is 100 % provided by fossil fuels; more fossil fuels are burnt, and a greater carbon footprint is created by EVs compared to vehicles powered by a conventional combustion engine.

For the advocates of EVs that statement is blasphemy. I request that those who feel that way avoid attacking me, but attempt to articulate a counter argument based on facts.

We are in a process of massive change to EVs costing society trillions of dollars based on talking points resting on a house of cards.
I offer a counterpoint to the carbon footpring statement above.

Consider carbon capture and sequestration technology. I expect it will be more effective and less expensive to apply to a single, stationary point source CO2 emitter (such as a power plant) than to thousands of smaller, mobile CO2 sources (cars and trucks).
https://sequestration.mit.edu/
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  #28  
Old 01-17-2021, 08:12 AM
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A couple of things,,If you have ever lived in a big city you may be aware of the poor air quality,mostly from cars,..yes,..some/many powerplants burn fossile fuels (but not 100% of our electricity now comes form fossile fuels )
and the stack push it up higher out of the cities air most of the time (admiditly not really a great thing a temp fix ) OK YOU look up the health costs of air polution,..its pretty substantial and shocking nationally.

Then there is the more efficency of an electric motor over a gas burner. A number of things come into play.
I'm impressed with battery tecnology today,..I recenly purchased a Craftsman jaws branch lopper,..good up to 4 inches, It came with a small rechargable battery. I though it would not last doing all of the branches that came down in a storm a while ago. Pleasently surprised how much work it did and still had some left.
The old NICAD batteries of a few years ago would have never done that.
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  #29  
Old 01-17-2021, 08:38 AM
twofishy4u twofishy4u is offline
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Can't find the figures but I"d be betting a new electric vs gas vehicle has more emissions driving to 100k. Reasoning......HOW MANY EMISSIONS ARE CREATED BUILDING THESE LITHIUM BATTERIES? WHY ARE THEY ALL BUILT IN CHINA? WHERE THERE ARE LITTLE TO NO REGULATIONS? Figure at a 100K these batteries are now junk,,,,,, what do we do with them? Seriously toxic stuff.

This electric car push is here and we aren't going to stop it. I do wish this country could find a giant river in the middle of the country that had multiple dams that could be converted to hydro-electic power. If only we had such a thing!!!!!!

OH WAIT WE DO!!!!
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  #30  
Old 01-17-2021, 08:57 AM
buckmaster7600 buckmaster7600 is offline
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Originally Posted by twofishy4u View Post
Can't find the figures but I"d be betting a new electric vs gas vehicle has more emissions driving to 100k. Reasoning......HOW MANY EMISSIONS ARE CREATED BUILDING THESE LITHIUM BATTERIES? WHY ARE THEY ALL BUILT IN CHINA? WHERE THERE ARE LITTLE TO NO REGULATIONS? Figure at a 100K these batteries are now junk,,,,,, what do we do with them? Seriously toxic stuff.

This electric car push is here and we aren't going to stop it. I do wish this country could find a giant river in the middle of the country that had multiple dams that could be converted to hydro-electic power. If only we had such a thing!!!!!!

OH WAIT WE DO!!!!

Isn’t that always the climate crisis believers agenda? Regulate production out of the US so it ends up in some 3rd world country that has zero oversight over any type of emissions. Then they talk about how much they’ve helped the US become cleaner. Unfortunately the same product is being produced and just under someone else’s roof. Unfortunately we all live under the same ozone so it’s just the smoke and mirror.


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