Is Technology somewhat to blame for the problems that seem to be arising in Wis/MN?

[Gary Korsgaden]

Good points technology certainly has improved success. Experiencing the era of fishing education now social media impact.Angling has transitioned to enjoyment measured by numbers and instant gratification. Which is driven by social media Facebook "brag book". But I feel social media is burning out angler interest. The mystery, intrigue of learning and finding out is gone.

4 fish is a start 3 fish and 6 storage limit would make a greater difference. Would it pass? Some feel going to three too drastic.

We can educate others without regulations in place too. Call out those that are taking too many fish or catching and releasing high numbers of fish and the risk of delayed mortality. Set a example.

Some guides today are well networked too....when one gets on a hot bite...they all know about it and hit the spot repeatedly.

Contributing factors that add up.

Industry drives it too, wanting success with their products

No easy answers, why wait for regs start now

[Ozark Bob]

Very encouraging to see this discussion! While there are many factors involved, the one we truly have some control over is managing ourselves. Proper fish handling,to reduce delayed mortality. Not catching fish from over 30' down, to prevent barotrama. Actually stop fishing after your limit is reached, try to catch something else. In-Fisherman has been preaching "Selective Harvest" forever. We can make the biggest impact without waiting for the political and scientific worlds to arrive at a "Good soultion". JMHO Bob

[thump55]

Custom has it right.

Without doubt, by far, the single most impactful factor to fish harvest over the last 20 years has been the internet.

Granted, harvest is only one element in the health of a fishery, but I don't think the DNR has realized how much more harvest there has been due to the internet. Regs and limits have not been adjusted to compensate and we are seeing the effects.

[Baseline]

I live in northern MN and have day-trip access to some of the best walleye lakes in North America. Minnesota has been imposing targeted limits on specific mahor lakes for years. 25 years US Lake of the Woods had a limit of 16 fish in combination of walleye and sauger with no more than 10 being walleye. This winter the limit lowered to 6 total combination. The Rainy River which flows between Rainy and LOW had a zero limit last spring. Lake Vermilion and Rainy lake also had 3 and 4 fish limits. Mille Lacs has bumped around from zero to two to one depending on the year. Red Lake has also had various limits, but never more than 4.

Net result is that fisherman don't care that much about limits. When the season is on the ramps are full and the lakes are crowded. Same thing with ice fishing. Sure you hear some groveling about limits and blaming netting, but from what I can tell is they still head to the lake. That tells me fishing is about the experience and not the harvest.

[hnd]

Technology in both Social Media as well as the technology we use in the boats, on ice, etc, i do believe have an effect on our fisheries.



but i do believe there are numbers that can be used to make up for that growth.



If i'm to believe the numbers in MN, less fishing licenses are being bought than in the past (50's - 70's). So while the technology is making people better anglers, there are also less anglers than before (1 mil a year in the 50's and 60s' compared to 800k in the 2010's). So I'm not certain that it doesn't even out.



I also believe there are way more stocking programs today than there had been


I ALSO believe there is much more emphasis on CPR than there ever has been before.



For me its tough to poo poo social media culture, by the numbers nationally less fishing licenses are being bought. Something needs to be done to make the sport thrive and social media is one of those things. Everyone wants to crap on alex perric and the youtube gang of 20 somethings putting out videos that have a million views within days but you go to a bass pro where they are doing an appearance and kids are lined out the door to meet these guys.



are lots of kids dinks who disrespect conservation yes but they can be taught. a 14 yr old keeping too small of fish is way easier to teach than a 70 year old throwing bowfin on the bank.

[KPKyllo]

I agree that technology plays a part but there are many other facets to the issues that we are seeing in Wisconsin and Minnesota as well and if there is a solution (I stress if), it'll be a combination of many things, many of which may be controversial.
If there is a solution, it may be a combination of lowering limits, slot limits, closed or catch and release only seasons after harvest quotas are met, increased emphasis on stocking efforts, and if climate change is actually part of the problem, increased emphasis on building forage bases suitable for warmer lakes or an increased focus on managing for species that are better suited to the changing environment. As much as it pains me to even think about it, some lakes that are now managed with walleyes as the primary species may be have to managed for different species as the primary species.
The decisions that may have to be made in the future may not be easy or very popular among many walleye fisherman.

[Coach Rob]

Interesting discussion. Complicated issue as well.

I think technology contributes greatly to harvest, but many of those who harvest the most are not that technologically advanced. By that I mean many of the 20% of the fishermen who catch 80% of the fish are simply experienced, good fishermen. Technology, for those that use it, has made them more efficient, allowing them to catch more fish in a shorter time frame.

But you still have to know how to fish. Simply finding fish with side imaging is only part of it. many of these fishermen are now older, and keep a lot of fish.

Overharvest is probably the single biggest contributing factor in my opinion. But I don't mean poaching.
#1, from what I have seen, are the fishermen who have a freezer full of fish, way beyond the possession limit. They may not take more than their bag limit, but they keep their limit every time they go out whether they need them or not. At the end of winter they toss out a bunch of freezer burned fish and repeat.
#2 Are the groups at resorts who keep everything they catch (see example below).


For instance:
I once watched a church group absolutely destroy a large section of a lake I stayed on for a couple weeks every year. The group of about 20 people focused on panfish primarily, and kept everything they caught. They bragged to the resort owner they caught and kept/ate over 2000 panfish along with many pike and bass during their 1 week stay. When I say they kept everything, they kept potato chip size bluegills, 15" pike, etc..

An area that was full of small fish before their arrival was a dead zone for 2 years after they left. The resort owner let them know they were not welcome to return. I had a spirited discussion with them about conservation. Everyone in their group kept every fish they caught. I doubt anyone went over the bag limit, and they ate them all so they probably broke no laws. But in 1 week they changed the lake for at least 2 years.

The Canadian regulations are spot on to keep the population healthy, i.e. how many fish you can have in your possession, and the graduated license that puts more money into the resources if you keep more fish. But the border crossing allows them a very effective way to enforce those regulations. Enforcement would be an issue in the states.

Example 2: I fish a large clear lake in Wisconsin. I talked to a couple guys at the landing who were leaving with their limit of walleye. After they left a local came over to me said, watch for them when you are out later, they are going to make that same trip a couple more times.

You can throw in spearing in northern Wisconsin and loss of spawning habitat, along with the environmental change (those changes are still in their infancy in Wisconsin, but it is starting to change things).

Wisconsin has been gradually cutting their DNR budget to the bone. Cutting stocking, eliminating warden, reseacher and ranger positions, etc. There will be no one left to enforce the laws we co have.

On the positive side:
I fish Green Bay. I expect there may be a positive bump in the next 3-5 years if the water levels hold. Many of the spawning grounds that were no longer used due to low water are filling back up. An area know for spring perch, one I fished as kid, has not had water for 20+ years. It is full this year. If the perch and walleye find it, they should have amazing year classes coming up. I would expect the same with river based systems (Winnebago) and flowages. Some of the lost spawning habitat will be accessible again on many bodies of water.

[Kyle Posterick]

Its interesting Canadian regulations are brought up. If you compare Ontario with MN you see Ontario has less people, significantly more water and much better quality of water for walleye, yet limits are quite lower.


The limits set in MN are arguably far more political than biological, given that Red cant sustain a 6 fish limit I don't understand why anyone would think other lakes can support 6 fish. People say the limits aren't met often, but what is the impact of two guys sitting on a spot and taking say 3 limits of fish on a small lake? 18 healthy breeders in a 200 acre lake may cripple the spawning population.


Stunting is another huge issue, especially in panfish. You may never "fish out" a lake of a particular species but you may change the size structure of the breeding fish to the point where the lake no longer produces good sized fish, those issues take many years to correct.


Tech has undoubtedly made people better fishermen. Even just dependable trucks and wheelhouses have created a huge surge in winter mortality. Flashers let you tailor a presentation to the most fickle fish and good augers let you punch hundreds of holes. I think open water fishing has had a similar surge but not to the extent ice fishing has seen.


Left unchecked winter harvest will become the limiting factor for many lakes. Wheelhouses and easy access let people fish until they cripple lakes. The money in the industry means it wont change until its probably to far gone.

[Custom Eyes]

Originally Posted by Coach Rob

Overharvest is probably the single biggest contributing factor in my opinion. But I don't mean poaching.
#1, from what I have seen, are the fishermen who have a freezer full of fish, way beyond the possession limit. They may not take more than their bag limit, but they keep their limit every time they go out whether they need them or not. At the end of winter they toss out a bunch of freezer burned fish and repeat.
#2 Are the groups at resorts who keep everything they catch (see example below).

That is poaching though. That's what the local ice fishermen have done to lakes up here. They're all laid off for the winter, so they ice fish almost every day of the week, keeping a limit whenever they can, and build a freezer full of pike and panfish to last them through the warm/working months, and then some. A lot of it ends up in the garbage or as compost because they took far more than they needed. They decimated my favorite local lake and it still hasn't recovered. Last time it got this bad, the DNR had to institute lake specific restrictions, which only ends up hurting the legal fishermen because the poachers don't change their ways and still keep grossly violating possession limits.

[kswalleyer]

Originally Posted by Baseline

I live in northern MN and have day-trip access to some of the best walleye lakes in North America. Minnesota has been imposing targeted limits on specific mahor lakes for years. 25 years US Lake of the Woods had a limit of 16 fish in combination of walleye and sauger with no more than 10 being walleye. This winter the limit lowered to 6 total combination. The Rainy River which flows between Rainy and LOW had a zero limit last spring. Lake Vermilion and Rainy lake also had 3 and 4 fish limits. Mille Lacs has bumped around from zero to two to one depending on the year. Red Lake has also had various limits, but never more than 4.

Net result is that fisherman don't care that much about limits. When the season is on the ramps are full and the lakes are crowded. Same thing with ice fishing. Sure you hear some groveling about limits and blaming netting, but from what I can tell is they still head to the lake. That tells me fishing is about the experience and not the harvest.

This is me....my inlaws just can't fathom me spending all this time and $$$ on the water, taking all these pics of nice fish , which I handle and release carefully, only to hear I eat MAYBE 1 meal(a few 14"ers) in a week when up North somewhere. I just smile and tell them if I have to explain it, they will never get it....I love the experience, the process, the places and people. I don't need to eat fish all the time even though I enjoy a plate of walleye as much as anyone.....not judging those who follow the laws....

now if I could find a way to catch and release deer, pheasants, quail, ducks yada yada

I also think the internet has had a huge impact. I'll be the first to admit I like to go to the places I see people fishing on line..but I don't lean on em hard...