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Old 04-14-2020, 06:34 AM
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turtle chain turtle chain is offline
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: waukesha wi
Posts: 1,374

Originally Posted by clawman View Post
Here diesel costs 20% more than gasoline.
Diesel - 2.35
Gas - 1.96
If I average 18 mpg with my 6.2 gas GMC truck can I get a 20% increase with the 3.l diesel engine? Anyone out there getting 21-22 mpg average with your diesel truck? not one miracle trip but on average.
My truck is a 2013 gmc 2500 First off you never get a consistent mpg driving a big box down the road wind is a big factor.And the new clean diesel changes the game big time all that said I check my mpg after the regen.I reset my avg mpg with out the regen and no wind and no load running at 65-70 mpg on a good day I have seen 20-21 that is not accurate because of the regen so 16-18 is more real.These trucks are very capable of some good mpg with out the emission crap! also they go into the dealer way to much $$. But I just love to drive this truck it is awesome tow vehicle so smooth and the tranny is amazing.Would I buy another sadly probably not and I love diesel trucks
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Old 04-14-2020, 11:44 AM
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Pooch Pooch is offline
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Location: The dysfunctional "state?" of Illinois
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Default One more thing

"Regen" is BS.

My daily driving (aside from my post earlier today) runs about 18 mpg. That is stop and go, pickup drop off, etc..

When the regeneration cycle starts mpg drops to 13 to 15 mpg at best. So how is it helping the environment when it kills the mileage about once a week to clean and burn out the catalytic converter? If you stop the engine while it is regenerating it will have to re-start completely over once you restart the engine. Also, I was told by a tech that you need to be driving at least 55 mph to do a full cycle of regenerating. Somehow that information gets lost in the sales floor.

Do I love this 2017 2500 HD? The most comfortable, best riding, best tow vehicle I've ever owned.

Do I hate this 2017 2500 HD when it stops and starts the regeneration cycle? Yes.


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Old 04-15-2020, 06:48 AM
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turtle chain turtle chain is offline
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Location: waukesha wi
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Default Trucks

one thing I have notice over the years is if you plow heavy snow the diesel truck with the right tires makes one **** of a plow truck.I sold my 01 GMC duramax to the guy who plows my drive way he stated he could push down trees with this thing .He now bought a gasser it is a good truck but it isn't as good for plowing .No replacing the low end grunt of a diesel.A friend of mine has a ram cummins for his plow truck that thing is amazing the torque it has So the moral to the story is a diesel has its place in this world they are not going to save you any money at all
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Old 04-15-2020, 10:46 AM
wh500special wh500special is offline
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Southern IL
Posts: 172

The HD diesels in heavy pickups are amazing engines and the last couple of comments verify just that. Just a reminder that the original post was asking about gas vs. diesel in a half ton truck and he is comparing two engines with essentially the same upgrade cost compared to the standard offering.

The diesel engines offered in the ¾ and 1-ton trucks are bruisers which are tuned more for grunt than thrift. The small 3-liter diesels in the half ton trucks are primarily meant as a means of increasing fuel economy while still providing adequate pulling power to handle a substantial trailer.

These smaller diesels are down on horsepower compared to the gas engines in the same trucks. Since they have a lot of torque the manufacturers are giving them generous tow ratings probably as a means of making them “worth it” as an upgrade where a buyer can have his cake (fuel economy) and eat it too (tow capacity). But they will be slower up a hill or into the wind due to the lack of horsepower.

Compared straight across to the gas engines in the same series of trucks, they can make economic sense. The fuel economy improvement for similar rated capability is quite high. Driven gently on long trips, they have some real potential for tremendous range and economy. Even if you have to stop for bio breaks and refreshments way before the truck needs fuel, additional range is nice to have for providing flexibility in case of traffic, weather, side trips to Cabelas, whatever.

The extra fuel injected to burn off the soot in the exhaust filter during the regeneration cycle shouldn’t really be that significant to the operating costs of the truck. This extra fuel is already accounted for in the EPA mpg estimates. If you’re lugging it hard (lots of towing) or doing a lot of in-town driving then you’ll generate more soot which will require more regens. Even though it seems innocuous, diesel soot is proven to be an unhealthy problem along roadways much more so than being an environmental problem. (As an aside, it’s been found that direct injected gas engines are also creating dangerous particulates so it seems probable that exhaust filters are coming soon for gas engines.)

I don’t know if these light trucks give an indication that a regen cycle is occurring or not. In the 85000 miles I drove my diesel – which had no indicator for when it was flamethrowing the DPF – I only interrupted the cycle twice at the end of a drive, the telltale for which was the electric cooling fans continued to run. Regen should operate reasonably seamlessly on the highway if you’re not making a lot of short trips with the truck. Another reason diesels are better suited to longer drives and are not a good daily driver for in-towners.

The principle environmental problem with diesels is their affinity for producing NOx emisions. DEF additions are a reality to deal with the NOx emissions in a modern diesel. In bulk, the fluid really isn’t that expensive. I don’t know how the tank is sized in the new Chevy/GMC 1500, but in some diesel vehicles it is big enough to last about the same amount of time that would pass between oil changes so that maintenance can be performed at the same time.

Without either DEF or DPF the fuel economy of these diesels could be improved, but at the costs of increased smog and more people with respiratory problems. In urban areas, these are real problems and not just theoretical. These tradeoffs and additional equipment are geared more towards health than environment. The obvious solution to all of this would be just to make trucks with less mass and less power which would burn less fuel, emit fewer nasties, etc...but it’s an easier sell for the industry to put a highly sophisticated chemistry set under the hood than to ask a customer to compromise his towing ability or machismo.

Our lack of willingness to compromise is exactly why the small Ford Powerstroke, Ram Ecodiesel, and GM 1500 Duramax makes sense: bragging rights capacity and economy at a reasonable upcharge.

If we bought things solely based on economic decisions few of us would be able to justify much more than a 16’ boat with a 25-hp motor and a small crossover or minivan to pull it. It wasn’t really that long ago that 14 and 16 foot boats were considered normal, an 18-footer was a supertanker, and a full size truck was the size of today’s midsizers, and a Dodge Cummins churned out 160 hp in a one-ton truck.

In this frame of mind, the 3-liter diesels make sense to me as a way of enjoying bigger capability without as many penalties.

Anyway, did Clawman buy a truck yet?
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Old 04-15-2020, 12:33 PM
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turtle chain turtle chain is offline
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: waukesha wi
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get the extended warranty!! I have had 2 def tanks heaters sensors glo plugs injectors the crap fails it is $$$ to fix alot of mine failed under warranty so I was lucky so far? it will fail again to be sure.My wife calls my truck the lemon I tell her it is a really good truck that is at the dealer all the time I would like a 200.000 mile warranty my file cabinet isnt big enough for all the receipts .My old diesel was a dream never at the dealer best truck i ever owned my 2 cents one more head gasket

Last edited by turtle chain; 04-15-2020 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 04-16-2020, 07:52 PM
clawman clawman is offline
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Location: Spokane WA
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Thank you for the detailed feedback. No I did not buy a truck. With the stock market on sale by 25% or so I decided to keep this truck and invested more in Vanguard.
I'm thinking vehicles will get cheaper and stock prices will go.
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